Star Wars Topic

Except Hutt Space is literally in Republic space. They just hold so much power there that the republic hates messing with them.

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Sure overall, but if you were to compare the first films in each trilogies if anything the phantom menace is kinda qui gon’s movie.

Also Just because he’s rebellious against council that doesn’t give him depth, and every time he tried to negotiate anything he failed . And just saying I think liam neeson is a brilliant actor who did the best he could with what he was given.

Where has that been stated?

Qui-gon didn’t fail in his negotiations with Watto. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

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Actually it’s the exact opposite. Anakin Skywalker was a person that cared so much for his loved ones that it lead him to the Dark Side because he cherished them too much. It started with his mother, and continued with Padme. Showing him as a child begins to show the audience the character flaws he has, and shows the pros and cons to the Jedi Code.

The Jedi were too emotionally detached, which meant that if a member did start feeling love of the romantic sort, it often turned out bad. Look at Anakin and Quinlin Vos in the Dark Disciple novel. They weren’t trained on how to deal with those feelings, because of the Code.

I’m just going to quote this rather than type it out again.

With the exception of Leia remembering Padme directly after birth (I chalk that one up to the Force), everything else pretty much falls into place. For a long while I thought I had read somewhere that Breha Organa had died when Leia was young, but upon double checking that, in both canon and legends she lived until Alderaan went poof. That would have been a fine explanation had I been right… Please list some examples of things you may think of as inconsistencies.

Couldn’t have said it better myself.

Ultimately, the Prequel Trilogy is more the story of the failings of the Jedi Order and how that leads to the rise of Darth Vader. The Jedi Order, which is a religion, had boiled down said religion to a science to where they even know how they can tap into the Force (because Midi Chlorians are NOT the force, just the cells that allow a Force user to access it) and became so arrogant in their literal ivory towers that they couldn’t smell a Sith Lord right under their noses. Had they been more open to attatchments, and not tried to shut them off completely, then maybe Anakin wouldn’t have gone all murdery. Also, even with the rules that were in place, if Qui-Gon had trained Anakin, it would have been different.

Qui-Gon talked about the living Force a lot. He told Anakin how to tap into the power, but treated it like the mystical thing that it was, which many Jedi did not. Look at Nadar Vebb in Clone Wars. He saw it only as a source of power, and that’s what led to his death at the hands of Grievous.

This is what I find fascinating about the title of The Last Jedi, as Luke may actually want the Jedi to stay gone and create a new tribe of in-between guardians because of how corrupt the Jedi Order and their code became.

Haha, I see what you did there.

In Episode I after the podrace he does say “I lost everything”, with maybe the exception of Shmi. But…

It does seem like he managed to rebuild and claim some of his business back. He’s a gambler. He could have won everything back the very next day in a game of Sabacc for all we know.

Getting transport to Theed from the Gungans?

Getting Watto to agree to the podrace in the first place? There wasn’t any mind trickery there, just good old fashioned knowledge of how greedy people act. It was negotiating 101, really. Make the other person feel like they’re getting something no matter what.

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Glad to see someone noticed. :smiley:

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This is technically fine and actually a pretty solid idea, the issue though is that a whole movie is dedicated to him being a kid and the things you have mentioned only take up a small portion of screen time and could have easily been shown either as a prologue scene. Seeing the rest of his childhood is still irrelevant.

Not trying to bash this book, but all supplemental material is irrelevant as well. If a movie did not answer a question than that’s a case of poor writing, even if a book does explain it.

This isn’t bad in of itself, but hammy presentation can really make or break something. The more you think about it, Anakon’s character is pretty lacking which doesn’t help. He has a more defined personality one CW.[quote=“prentice1215, post:570, topic:651”]
also creates a huge number of inconsistencies with the original movies.

It does no such thing. Please list some examples of things you may think of as inconsistencies, and I’ll explain them.
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Leia states in Episode VI remembering her mother. Problem is in Episode III Padme dies right after giving birth. Obi-Wan didn’t remember Leia in Episode V but in Episode III holds her right after she’s born. I don’t care how many books explain this, this is still an example of writers not keeping track of things.

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We didn’t see the rest of his childhood. We saw the defining moments of the Jedi Order discovering him, and taking him away from his mother, creating his first issue with attachments. It’s not like the whole movie was “Here’s what he was like as a baby! And here’s what he was like at 10! Here’s what he was like at 14!” etc. We got the significant moment we needed and moved on.

I didn’t mean the book explains it, I just was using it as an extra example of another Jedi falling to the dark side due to attachment problems. It’s evident in the movies enough with Anakin.

This I literally was fixing in my above post as you posted, so that’s untimely. I’ll go ahead and quote it.

I think you mean in IV? He talks to Luke about her being his sister in VI, so I think you mean IV.

There’s no indication that Obi-Wan “doesn’t remember” Leia. It’s probably just that he doesn’t tell Luke the whole truth, like he did that entire afternoon. The whole thing about Uncle Owen not wanting Anakin to get involved is most likely Bantha poodoo. We get no indication in Episode II that Owen wishes Anakin would stay on Tatooine to help on the moisture farm. It’s just like how Obi-Wan misleads Luke by saying a Jedi named Darth Vader killed Anakin, instead of Anakin becoming Darth Vader. What he says is true, from a certain point of view. And of course that has even been explored further as almost a split personality type thing with Dark Side users with Kylo Ren claiming that he “destroyed” Ben Solo, and Darth Vader saying the same to Ahsoka in Rebels.

How would the information about Leia being his sister been good to reveal at that time? To reveal that, he would have needed to spin another lie, or open up the whole can of worms right then and there. He just kept his trap shut, simple as that.

Same thing with not remembering R2. R2 never belonged to Obi-Wan, he belonged to Anakin. R2 just said he belonged to him as an excuse to get the message delivered. So either Obi-Wan played coy in that situation, or he legitimately didn’t remember, because Star Wars had pointed out in several instances that droids all look the same to people.

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He kinda did he failed to use a mind trick

Okay.

Seems like I’m a little bit late to this party, but for some reason TTV kept popping up as a “mature website” and I couldn’t access it.

Let’s look this over, shall we?

Yeah. Like nothing that wasn’t represented later, better, and made more fans happy. [quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
The Jedi are supposed to be a force for good and to safeguard the Republic, but the second they figure out he’s their ancient enemy they go straight in to assassinate him. That’s not democracy!
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Assuming you mean Palpatine.

No, that’s not Democracy… That’s common sense. You have the most powerful fiend of intergalactic terrorism and war sitting in oval office, collapsing everything in on itself so he can rise to absolute power. I doubt sitting by for an electoral vote while he continues to get you all killed is the smartest idea, especially when you are the justice of the peace.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
The Jedi Purge would have probably happened anyway, because the Senate would have turned on them after that.
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Or, y’know, they would have shown them his lightsaber, exposed his plot to destroy the republic, probably put Valorum back in because he wasn’t that bad tbh…[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
The Clone Wars as a whole is probably one of the dumbest wars ever
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Have you noticed it’s a lot like wars in history? gee, it’s almost as if George thought this all out in his younger, saner days… Y’know, considering he mentioned it in the first movie three times.

Obviously he didn’t think of every wrinkle; if he did they might be good movies.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
I think one of the biggest problems with the prequels aren’t the films themselves, but the fans who watched them.
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Um… The same fans who are noticing George didn’t do as good as he did the first three times and are not particularly happy with it?[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
From 1983 to 1999 is a big gap, and is plenty of time to let expectations run wild
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Except they really didn’t.

The audience for watching Star Wars movies has changed drastically, and thus so must the movies. As you can (hopefully) guess, no one can air It’s A Wonderful Life in theaters today and expect it to be a box office hit, because it’s made for audience of a yesteryear. If we got another Star Wars in the same style as the originals… Nobody would like it.

However that doesn’t mean these are good.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
Again, duh, because the “good guys” right now are the bad guys later on! Of course everything would be shiny. And things get grimy, like on Tatooine, or Geonosis, or Mustafar.
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…

Mustafar isn’t worth even mentioning. It’s about 3 acres of lava, and that’s all we ever see. And yes, it was shockingly sleek for what there was, considering it was a harvesting facility with absolutely horrible building plans.

Tatooine was actually pretty decent. But that’s about it.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
Still, the plot of Obi-Wan looking for Kamino and the start of the Clone War makes it up for me
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Exactly how? Here Obi-Wan goes off to meet aliens we never see again, to meet Jango Fett who dies really shortly after, on a planet not worth mentioning. And the CG leading up to that… My lands.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
So then we get two great scenes in between some Battle of Utapau stuff.
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Where?[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
Anakin learns that Palpatine is Sidious and can save Padme (so he says). Anakin follows his instincts and tells Windu, who then changes his mind about going to try to persuade Palpatine to leave office, to just force him out entirely. Anakin senses what’s happening and arrives in time to be an accomplice to murder (unless Windu is alive still…), and seeing what Mace was about to do forces his hand. The Jedi are no different than the evil Sith he was taught to hate, and Anakin has to become what he was sworn to destroy to save his wife, which then does the opposite. The tragedy of Anakin Skywalker is complete.
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  1. Don’t mention Mace being alive, please. We’re sticking with the movies, not the theories. Otherwise we could go with the theory that the prequels are good.

  2. Anakin “sensing” what’s happening is called his slow intellect finally realizing what’s going on. Hayden had his career ruined by this abomination of a movie and I’m not going to be gentle to it.

  3. Anakin didn’t become nothin’. He suddenly switched perspective after he realized he just killed one of his masters and mentors. “Oh my lands, I killed master Windu… Well I never had parenting so I’m just gonna go with my emotions and the disfigured old man standing next to me instead of even putting up a fight on my part.” And then he put contacts on. Scene cut good shot everybody, let’s go get some donuts[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
    Everything leading up to “Henceforth you shall be known as Darth… Vader” is perfectly logical by film standards and isn’t a spur-of-the-moment change like so many like to complain it is.
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Oh, no no no no. The Darth… Vader bit is perfectly fine. Everything else is not.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
I can see why, even if I don’t agree. The Prequels at least tried something different. They gave us a backstory that has more going on than people like to think, where The Force Awakens started off strong, but kind of devolved into all of the typical Star Wars tropes by the end of the film.
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TFA was a bag of tropes and bad acting, I grant you that, but we’re here to talk about the prequels. And by the way, they technically didn’t try anything different. These were all concepts in George’s head around the time of the original Star Wars, ones he couldn’t fulfill.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
(even if his real name being Ben makes zero sense)
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…Kenobi. Cough cough.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
I like Jar Jar. I do. I was in Kindergarten
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Of course you do; you were the age range when you saw him. Jar jar was a Disney trope; stupid side character idiot who is the laughing gagball of the film. Show me a Disney animated movie that doesn’t have at least one.

You do realize he was the comedy relief, right? the kid’s joke? that this film was specifically engineered for kids to watch?[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
Jar Jar kept me going through Phantom Menace when otherwise, kids would have spaced out during the politics sequences
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Bingo.

You have just defined Jar Jar’s purpose, and why he was a problem. I don’t see how this is a defense argument.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
He figured, “I’ll throw in some more complex themes and ideas for this audience that has grown up, while still keeping it fairly fun for the new crowd”.
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Technically it is.

It’s just absolutely horrible.[quote=“prentice1215, post:523, topic:651”]
So, after spending nearly an hour and a half writing this essay, I present my argument to you
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In a nutshell, the main defense is Jar Jar, who is an absolute problem and didn’t fix nothin’. He was a kid’s trope that ate up time and distracted younger audiences from realizing how dry the movies were. They even figured out how to mess Grievous up. I mean, how do you mess up the quick-moving, jedi killing machine that debuted in Clone Wars? George left to nothing but his out devices. It wasn’t George who made Star Wars what it is, it was an idea in which everybody contributed. And I’m sorry to say, but this is what happens when George Lucas thinks everything he does is right and all the actors agree so they get a bigger paycheck.

It’s not movie making anymore. It’s money printing. If you don’t believe me, check the Guiness book of world records and see what the highest grossing movie at box office is: Episode 1. Possibly the worst Star Wars movie ever made. And that’s all it was, is and ever will be - a money machine, until about 2070, when the license on Star Wars expires and people can finally fix it.

Sorry, but the prequels are bad to the core and rotted from the inside out long ago. If you like them, good, you can get some enjoyment out of them. But I’m sticking with Star Trek.

…On a species that was immune to mind tricks.[quote=“prentice1215, post:573, topic:651”]
Same thing with not remembering R2. R2 never belonged to Obi-Wan, he belonged to Anakin. R2 just said he belonged to him as an excuse to get the message delivered. So either Obi-Wan played coy in that situation, or he legitimately didn’t remember, because Star Wars had pointed out in several instances that droids all look the same to people.
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Obi-Wan has existed alongside R2 for so long that it’d be rather hard for him not to recognize him. At first might have been a challenge, since he was currently some distance away and R2 was in the shadows.

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In the movies maybe, but in real life the actor was apparently a bit of a creep around Natalie Portman

Also I’m aware that my that toydarians are immune to mind tricks. I was more making s joke than an actual point.

We get significant moments but that still doesn’t change the fact that most of the events covering Anakin in Episode I aren’t necessary. Ask yourself, is stuff like pod racing really that important to any thing in the grand scheme of things. No. Not really.

It was actually V, but yeah I still got that detail wrong, I apologize there. I was referring to the scene where he’s talking to Yoda right after Luke leaves Dagobah.

It actually was, like, incredibly important. First off, it established the fact that Anakin was incredibly powerful in the Force without his even realizing it. No human had ever competed in a podrace; the fact that he didn’t crash was amazing, let alone the fact that he won. Second, without the podrace, Anakin wouldn’t have won his freedom. His entire future was betting on the race. If he hadn’t competed and won, Anakin Skywalker wouldn’t be a name of any significance in the Star Wars universe.

I don’t think that would have mattered. We have a certain perspective on things because we’re the audience. But let’s say in ancient Rome, the Catholic Church ran into Rome, took out the Emperor, and said “it’s okay, he was a bad guy!”. Do you think that would have gone over well? Actually, considering a good chunk of the population was Christian, it may have actually gone over okaish.

The Jedi Order was something that everyone in the Republic knew about but didn’t really know much about, let alone trust much of the time. If this small sect of a religious order (ten thousand is not large on a galactic scale) came in and deposed the in-office leader of the government, there would be repercussions no matter what their excuse. To a random person living in the Republic that wasn’t disenchanted with it, Palpatine was a stand up guy who could do no wrong. His death would have caused public outcry and the Senate would have had the Clone Army turn on the Jedi anyway.

Except, you know, they did. How many times have you seen someone say, “this isn’t Star Wars”? Everyone has an idea of what Star Wars is. Some people don’t even like Return of the Jedi because they think it’s too silly. The stuff in the prequels went against what people expected, and so they reacted negatively.

I’m not sure what you’re saying here. Are you saying Mustafar was sleek but had a bad building design? What’s the comment about the overall ascetic about the Prequels, or is that it?

It’s a big mystery. Kamino somehow doesn’t exist on any public records anymore. It’s been whiped from the charts. It’s as if someone took the name of a small town in Texas where the military was secretly doing stuff off the map. What’s the big secret? Why is it so secret you had to tamper with public records? When you find the place, why do people say they’re expecting you? What’s really going on? Who’s pulling the strings here? That’s not intriguing in the slightest? And what do you mean Geonosis isn’t even worth mentioning?

Oh, come on, you don’t even like the Opera scene and the “Anakin-Padme-stare-at-each-other-but-not-really-while-Palpatine-Force-talks-to-Anakin” scene?

There’s also a few Kashyyyk scene mixed in too. Forgot about those.

Was just acknowledging it. Not trying to prove or disprove anything.

Finally realizing? With the doubts Palpatine put into Anakin’s head about the council at that point, but still wanting to trust them, of course it took him awhile to finally sense what was happening. He was a conflicted mess, and that was only one of the things he was dealing with.

Have you never had to make a decision along the lines of “maybe I should… maybe I shouldn’t… but then again… no, I shouldn’t… but… no… ok, I’m doing it”. That’s what Anakin was going through. Sensing the massacre in Palpatine’s office finally got him moving.

Have we watched different movies? It’s painfully obvious to me all the things that led up to him becoming Darth Vader. Clear and crystal. It wasn’t sudden. Again, even without The Clone Wars helping him along the path, Episode III still does a good job pushing Anakin over the edge of the path he started on in Episode II when he murdered the Tusken village. He gave into his fears and doubt.

Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.

Fear of losing his mother, wife, and unborn child, put on top of doubts about the Jedi Council and Jedi code lead to anger against them. This leads to his hatred of the Jedi and his overconfidence in his new found power. His hate leads to him being burned to a crisp on Mustafar and forced to live the rest of his life on life support inside a suit.

How anyone can think he just all of a sudden changed in the blink of an eye puzzles me.

But he didn’t utilize them until the Prequels. An idea can be in your head as long as you want, but until it’s been put into effect, it might as well not exist. George obviously had some semblance of what he wanted to do. In the Episode IV novelization, in the opening pages, it describes the events that led to the formation of the Empire that Alan Dean Foster included based on George’s notes. We didn’t see all the intricacies of that until the 90s. Compared to the OT, the Prequels tried new things, yes.

Duh. I’m not an idiot, of course he’s named after Ben Kenobi. Han did nothing but back talk and disrespect Obi-Wan in the short time he knew him. Maybe when he grew older his view on Old Ben softened, seeing as he did sacrifice himself, and he and Leia decided to go with Ben because of that, or maybe because of how much he meant to Luke, or both.

But we don’t know that. Unless it comes up in The Last Jedi or Episode IX, there has been nothing to support why Han would want that as a name for his son.

Yes. You even show that I realize that.

See? Jar Jar is the comic relief to keep the kids entertained, as I said. Now, would a better comic relief keep both kids and adults happy? Absolutely. But Jar Jar performs his task perfectly in entertaining the kids. It’s just an unfortunate byproduct that adults seem to loath him.

In your opinion.

This is the “problem” with Grievous in Episode III and Clone Wars (mainly CW). Grievous is a deadly warrior who’s both acrobatic and smart. He’s killed many Jedi (as seen by his trophy collection in Clone Wars), and won a lot of battles. The Jedi talk about this. The problem is, is that most of the canon screen time we have with him, he’s fighting Obi-Wan or he’s leading an army via the command center before going out to kill NPCs. Because of his constant duels with Obi-Wan in CW, we can’t see him win (because that would mean killing Kenobi, which can’t happen), so he has to follow Dooku’s advice from the same series that made him a murder machine and retreat, since he’s obviously not winning.

In Episode III, he’s cornered by Obi-Wan and Anakin in a cramped space. Not much to do but escape into space and hope they get sucked into vacuum and reclaim the ship, or just retreat. The battle was lost either way, so it was a win-win (sorta) situation in that regard. His fight with Obi-Wan on Utapau would prove to be his last, so of course it’s well documented he lost that fight. It only looks like he loses a lot and is a coward because we don’t get to see him against characters that can be killed off like majority of Jedi on Hypori during the micro series (it was retconned that basically all of those Jedi ended up living anyway, save one or two). That I can see being put on George still, and I’ll accept that argument, but I still see Grievous as the savage killer he was in the micro series.

Well, if that was your view before the purchase, that hasn’t changed with the mouse in charge…

I hate Disney

I think Lucas saw it both ways. He saw a way to make money, but he also had a story he wanted to tell. Like with the originals he also spent a lot of money to make these films. If someone only wanted to make money, I’d think they’d spend as little as possible to rake in the maximum rewards.

Yes, I do.

“He was the best star-pilot in the galaxy…”- Obi-Wan Kenobi, Episode IV: A New Hope

The podrace sequence shows that even from a young age he was adept at piloting, and was strong with the force. Same with taking down the Droid control ship.

Also this.

Obi-Wan didn’t believe in Leia. Yoda did. Obi-Wan didn’t think Anakin was the chosen one, he thought it was Luke. Luke would bring balance to the Force by destroying the Sith. Obi-Wan spent time with Luke and started his training. He had maybe a few hours contact with Leia as a baby. Obi-Wan’s sole hope was in Luke, as evident by his “That boy is our last hope…”, while Yoda thinks Leia could be a back up OR he’s talking about Anakin, which he would be right about. Anakin does fuffil the prophecy and destroy the Sith after some prodding from Luke.

Of course in 1980 is was really just to make the audience go “Whaaaaa…?”

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That kind of thing actually happened quite a lot in history, because when you have a certain population of people who accept and respect you as authority figures (as the people of the galaxy did the Jedi) they are very willing to accept your explanation for such things, especially if it doesn’t dramatically affect their livelihood. If the Jedi then made themselves dictators, it might have gone over more poorly, but most of us know and believe that they wouldn’t have done that. Sure, there were probably patriots in the Republic who really supported Palpatine, but none of them had the power to orchestrate a Jedi Purge, and even combined they might not have had enough support. Palpatine succeeded because he had both total control and the advantage of being a Sith, meaning that if the Jefi had killed him, no one would remain to exercise the power he had, and even if they could have, they would not be able to beat the Jedi, as they were not Sith.

That’s not even a fair argument. How was he supposed to know Toydarians were immune to mind tricks?

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I’d buy that, except that it’s hinted throughout much of The Clone Wars that the Jedi were losing favor with the public everyday. In Season 2, there’s a recording of Palpatine defending the Jedi that Ahsoka clings to in “Lightsaber Lost” for instance. There’s a protest in front of the Jedi Temple at the beginning of the Ahsoka arc in Season 5. Also, the public as a whole believed Palpatine’s partially true story when he reformatted the Republic into the Galactic Empire. It was really only the founding members of the Rebel Alliance in the Senate, some freedom fighters like Saw Gerrera, and Galen and Lyra Erso who didn’t believe him. If the public really had cared that much for the Jedi, there would have been something noted about people questioning it.

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That’s true, but everyone certainly seemed to miss them when they were gone. And that still doesn’t detract from the fact that the Jedi had pretty much no choice but to take out Palpatine. After all, the public are not likely to believe that their leader is a Sith Lord, and not killing him only gives him more of a chance to do what he’s already done: gain even more power. What’s good for the Republic doesn’t matter in that moment. Killing him is the only option.

Yeah, like 10 years on. It didn’t happen overnight for most, and even then, there were some worlds that still liked the Empire after the Rebellion became a thing. That’s why there’s the First Order later on down the line.

It was a lose-lose situation for them for sure. Either kill the Chancellor because he’s evil and have the Senate kick you out at best or at worst kill you, or let the Chancellor become an Emperor and kill you all anyways.

Either way, that poor “Master Skywalker…” kid wasn’t going to live to see another birthday.

Ahem, please actually read a history book with some credibility. No, really. The Catholic church was Rome and still is.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
If this small sect of a religious order (ten thousand is not large on a galactic scale) came in and deposed the in-office leader of the government, there would be repercussions no matter what their excuse.
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Hey, that’s right.

Also, guess who saw them, and guess who could prove it was them, when it could easily be explained as a Sith?[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Palpatine was a stand up guy who could do no wrong. His death would have caused public outcry and the Senate would have had the Clone Army turn on the Jedi anyway.
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Again, there should have been absolutely no witness to Palpatine’s death. A shuttle goes to Palpatine’s quarters, a shuttle leaves. One dead Chancellor and no Sith Anakin. We’re just lucky ol’ Ani had emotional problems and nearly no self control.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
How many times have you seen someone say, “this isn’t Star Wars”?
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Every time they see the Prequels.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Everyone has an idea of what Star Wars is. Some people don’t even like Return of the Jedi because they think it’s too silly. The stuff in the prequels went against what people expected, and so they reacted negatively.
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Yes, because the quota was met and the Sequels failed miserably to come close to meeting it.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
I’m not sure what you’re saying here. Are you saying Mustafar was sleek but had a bad building design? What’s the comment about the overall ascetic about the Prequels, or is that it?
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There was too little Mustafar and what we did see was very disappointing. The building is not very smart because the large towers which serve no obvious purpose except being material to fight on later stand directly next to the giant pit of magma, next to a magmafall, etc. etc. and it all makes for a very campy fight scene which could have taken place anywhere else with an open flame.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
It’s a big mystery. Kamino somehow doesn’t exist on any public records anymore. It’s been whiped from the charts. It’s as if someone took the name of a small town in Texas where the military was secretly doing stuff off the map. What’s the big secret? Why is it so secret you had to tamper with public records? When you find the place, why do people say they’re expecting you? What’s really going on? Who’s pulling the strings here? That’s not intriguing in the slightest? And what do you mean Geonosis isn’t even worth mentioning?
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It exists for one segment and is otherwise not worth mentioning, as little occurs there. You might as well have put the cloning facility on the backside of Tatooine, at least that way we wouldn’t have had to meet Dexter Jetser.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Oh, come on, you don’t even like the Opera scene and the “Anakin-Padme-stare-at-each-other-but-not-really-while-Palpatine-Force-talks-to-Anakin” scene?
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…Remind me what there is to like.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Finally realizing? With the doubts Palpatine put into Anakin’s head about the council at that point, but still wanting to trust them, of course it took him awhile to finally sense what was happening. He was a conflicted mess, and that was only one of the things he was dealing with.
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Yes, you’re proving my point. He was so disdraught and dunderheaded that the immediate situation of Palpatine basically proving he was a Sith Lord to him didn’t stir one little hair on his head. It was only after a while that he realized his Senpai might die, so he rushed off to convince himself of it. Then we lost one of the only good roles Samuel L. Jackson ever played, Darth Icky the True was relabeled Darth… Vader, and Vader’s backstory was forever ruined by this horrible role.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Have we watched different movies? It’s painfully obvious to me all the things that led up to him becoming Darth Vader. Clear and crystal. It wasn’t sudden. Again, even without The Clone Wars helping him along the path, Episode III still does a good job pushing Anakin over the edge of the path he started on in Episode II when he murdered the Tusken village. He gave into his fears and doubt.

Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.

Fear of losing his mother, wife, and unborn child, put on top of doubts about the Jedi Council and Jedi code lead to anger against them. This leads to his hatred of the Jedi and his overconfidence in his new found power. His hate leads to him being burned to a crisp on Mustafar and forced to live the rest of his life on life support inside a suit.
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…

And then showing nearly nothing except anger at some of the Jedi’s bad decision making and having bad dreams.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
How anyone can think he just all of a sudden changed in the blink of an eye puzzles me.
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Except he did… He switched as soon as George told him to. It’s called acting, specifically bad acting.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
But he didn’t utilize them until the Prequels. An idea can be in your head as long as you want, but until it’s been put into effect, it might as well not exist. George obviously had some semblance of what he wanted to do. In the Episode IV novelization, in the opening pages, it describes the events that led to the formation of the Empire that Alan Dean Foster included based on George’s notes. We didn’t see all the intricacies of that until the 90s. Compared to the OT, the Prequels tried new things, yes.
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  1. He utilized the Clone Wars.
  2. He utilized the Emperor before he even existed.
  3. You literally just stated that he had some of the ideas written down, in novels.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
    Maybe when he grew older his view on Old Ben softened, seeing as he did sacrifice himself, and he and Leia decided to go with Ben because of that, or maybe because of how much he meant to Luke, or both.
    [/quote]

Hey, you answered it for me.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
But we don’t know that. Unless it comes up in The Last Jedi or Episode IX, there has been nothing to support why Han would want that as a name for his son.
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Except, y’know, the implications from what you just described. Oh, and the fact that Obi-Wan kinda saved all their lives and made a big impact which, while subtle, is still shown.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
See? Jar Jar is the comic relief to keep the kids entertained, as I said. Now, would a better comic relief keep both kids and adults happy? Absolutely. But Jar Jar performs his task perfectly in entertaining the kids. It’s just an unfortunate byproduct that adults seem to loath him.
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No, there’s another problem. He’s also a horrible comedy relief. Instead of actually being funny, which is his one job, or entertaining even, he’s obnoxious, idiotic, and somewhat terrifying in his animation. Done really well, Jar Jar Binks might be a really good character. However…[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
In your opinion.
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Kudos, kid. Kudos.

K, so um, remind me how CW is perfect.

Seriously, I know Grievous never really won against the significant jedi he was paired with. However he didn’t in anything he was in, neither did Vader when he wasn’t scripted to, and also why the main villain of a TV show doesn’t kill the protagonist quickly. However, Grievous was proved to be faster than the force in CW. If he couldn’t hold his own and be an incredibly deadly character…[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
In Episode III
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…He might just be the Episode III Grievous.

Nothing wrong here, except that he put up literally no fight to begin with. From a filmmaker’s perspective it’s fine, considering the four-arms deal was a reveal to most people.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
His fight with Obi-Wan on Utapau would prove to be his last, so of course it’s well documented he lost that fight.
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Did he have to completely suck at fighting while it happened? He starts with spinning his lightsabers in a block, marching towards Kenobi, who jabs in and stops the spin. Grievous cuts a few times and flips over his…

…Oh, he just stands there and puts all his lightsabers into blocking Kenobi’s repeatedly. Ah, there he blocks with one this time, letting him go in and stab…

…Oh. he just stands there and lets Kenobi take his hand off, despite having four other arms. Ok, so he…

…Does it again. Ok, here we go! he’s got him in a lock. He’s taunting him. Obi-Wan says the catchphrase. He reels back for a force push, and Grievous dodges…

…He stands there the whole time he’s deliberately drawing his arm back, despite being clearly strong enough to overpower Kenobi’s one lightsaber arm or quick enough to dodge the force blast. Okay, he’s fallen off the wall. Ooh, he’s going to pull an exorcist, hm? well this should be…

Boring, because he’s running away do I even have to go on? even at the very end, he doesn’t bother to cover his vital organs despite his chest previously being crushed by Mace Windu in CW.

Goodness, they can’t do anything right.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Well, if that was your view before the purchase, that hasn’t changed with the mouse in charge…
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Let’s talk TFA later.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
I think Lucas saw it both ways. He saw a way to make money, but he also had a story he wanted to tell. Like with the originals he also spent a lot of money to make these films. If someone only wanted to make money, I’d think they’d spend as little as possible to rake in the maximum rewards.
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George knows how to make money and put minimum effort into it. It’s called “make three really bad sequels to the original Star Wars movies and people will watch them anyway”. And by your arguments it seems to have worked.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
“He was the best star-pilot in the galaxy…”- Obi-Wan Kenobi, Episode IV: A New Hope
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This, uh, could have been dealt with literally any other way.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Obi-Wan didn’t think Anakin was the chosen one
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What.

He trained him, fought with him, fought him, knew he was far more powerful in the force than any other jedi or sith, and went to Luke as an alternative not because he stopped “believing in Anakin”.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Obi-Wan’s sole hope was in Luke, as evident by his “That boy is our last hope…”
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No, he was making sure his final reserve didn’t die. [quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Yoda thinks Leia could be a back up OR
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Or nothing. From the very beginning Yoda denied Anakin even being a Jedi. It makes sense that their hopes for the now-sith lord were dwindling away after so long. But Yoda was a greater jedi than Obi-Wan, and undoubtedly felt the force in Leia long before Obi-Wan started looking.[quote=“prentice1215, post:579, topic:651”]
Of course in 1980 is was really just to make the audience go “Whaaaaa…?”
[/quote]

So were many other things, like Vader being Luke’s dad.[quote=“prentice1215, post:582, topic:651”]
I’d buy that, except that it’s hinted throughout much of The Clone Wars that the Jedi were losing favor with the public everyday.
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Do you know how quickly the public today changes their collective mind? go to politics if you don’t believe me.[quote=“prentice1215, post:582, topic:651”]
there would have been something noted about people questioning it.
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It was probably an aftermath feeling, and the rousing applaud to kill the jedi were from Palpatine living, deformed, after the attack. Plus, if you go out and pity the crowds you can get them to do nearly anything.[quote=“prentice1215, post:584, topic:651”]
It was a lose-lose situation for them for sure. Either kill the Chancellor because he’s evil and have the Senate kick you out at best or at worst kill you, or let the Chancellor become an Emperor and kill you all anyways.
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Better to kill the Chancellor because he’s evil and tough out the storm, hoping someone good will replace him, than to let him live and make things a hundred times worse.[quote=“prentice1215, post:584, topic:651”]
Either way, that poor “Master Skywalker…” kid wasn’t going to live to see another birthday.
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Well, he could always be Snoke. Dont kill me i was being sarcastic

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