I drink literal concentrated caffeine and get consecutive hand surgeries every three days
WELL (adjusts glasses) AHKTUALLY IF YOU LOOK AT NIDHIKI HE CANONICALLY HAS FOUR LEGS SO AHKTUALLY HE’S A CENTAUR WHERE AM I GOING WITH THIS JOKE
I’m sorry. I have no sense of humor and I am decaying.
I don’t think you meant it this way, but the way that sounds to me is that you’re suggesting I didn’t join the discussion of the rules and make sound logical arguments, which I did, and was laughed at by Eljay and Meso for it. Yes, if one side was more calm and well spoken than the other, they would’ve won out, but the bigger problem I see is that the very people in charge of these contests are not on that side. As you said, you agree that they didn’t have much of a canon reason to bar custom torsos. It seems like an overreach to ban something from a canon contest that neither contradicts canon or is entered in bad faith, but simply because a part of the community doesn’t like it.
Maybe “semi-canon” isn’t the best way to describe my idea. Here’s what I mean.
Here are two different canon (I think) pictures of Thok. They have vastly different art styles, and feature slightly different designs, but they’re clearly the same character, right?
Similarly, these two pictures have drastically different art styles, and feature slightly different designs. But they’re still clearly depicting the same character.
What if instead of having one absolute winner, there were 3-5 winners, with each design being equally official? This way, we get a canon design, but not a 100% set-in-stone one. So one person could say, “I like this entry’s mask, but I prefer that one’s torso,” while another could say, “I like this entry’s weapon but I like the details on that one.”
There’d be a general design, but some of the details would be left to people’s own preferences.
In tabletop gaming, and possibly other communities as well, there’s this thing called a “death spiral”.
Okay, I see better what you mean… but I’d have to sleep on it. At the moment, the problem I see is that, for the Thok example, there’s a singular, definitive version of Thok (the set) that all subsequent depictions of the character (such as the comic artwork) are based on. But with the given Artakha example, you wouldn’t necessarily have that consistency, especially in the mask department. As you implied, it’d be a “pick and choose” of your favorite bits and pieces of each work. I do see the appeal of that method, but I don’t think it’d be for me.
“Visorak are not responsible for Nidhiki’s appearance.”
“So you see, what I told you was true. From a certain point of view.” -Greg Kenobi
Lol.
Plus it was Roodaka.
The appeal of the canon contest is to get a 100% set in stone canon model - and, more specifically, to also be the person to make it, for those entering. If it’s 50% or even 80% canon, it’s not truly canon, and the interest would be gone.
And like CMO said, if they’re both equal in canonicity, but have any kind of discernable difference whatsoever, subsequent iterations can feature those differences interchangeably and still be “canon”, Artakha being the best example as the two closest art entries featured completely different mask designs - and that’s pretty major considering it was a new mask depiction entirely.
A very, very, very adamant side. And the other side is equally adamant, but for the most part is begrudgingly okay with having the mandated Metru torso as long as things aren’t absurdly restrictive. Not mandating the Metru torso, on the other hand, would without a doubt cause fiery debates to triple in their ferocity and many people would be banned.
It’s a strategic answer which makes sense with the existing models and saves them the added legwork of defining what ‘looks like a Toa Hagah’ in explicit detail, and also saves them from explaining what Metru proportions are (this way, some models have completely ignored Metru proportions entirely, to which I say hoorah).
Their canon reasoning is absolutely weak, I completely agree. But it’s an understandable decision.
stop being well-thought out and reasonable when I’m being stupid
This convo is just proof that Hero Factory is better
There is nothing understandable about not only caving to the side that participated in more toxic behavior than the other (and as you said, probably would’ve been worse if custom torsos were allowed), but also Eljay and Meso participating in said behavior.
guys stop you’re making my head hurt
If we do Toa Mangai, we’d do them individually, right? Like for Nidhiki or Tuyet?
Yeah, they are.
But how would you do that in these contests? How would you ensure that all five (or however many) winning entries all share enough features so as to be recognizable as the same character?
I could get behind having multiple canon depictions with unique styles and details, but it doesn’t really seem to address any of the issues that are actually being discussed here.
I was going to make an argument for why the Mangai should be unique builds, and I still might, but I don’t want Tu-yet.
He says that in his post: all of them are based on the same physical model, just like all art of Thok. The only problem is the masks.
Which is why I think this could be viable for Nidhiki and Varian*, where we know the mask and it’s shape, so the art wouldn’t be deciding the mask shape. Perhaps characters like Lariska and Marendar as well, unless there’s some other aspect the art would decide.
*And technically Chiara, but I’d kinda like to see a group art shot for the TYQ team, even if their moc contests are seperate.
Y’know, I sort of like the idea that there are Toa (and potentially Matoran and Turaga) with more diverse body plans than what we’re used to. A centaur bug-man is extreme, but it does open the door to a lot of possibilities.
It would at least somewhat explain why and how the Piraka thought they could pass off as Toa.
(Though, of course, this idea no longer compatible with current canon.)
Heresy
The question comes: what defines a Toa’s physique?
From my memory, it is only the perception the Matoran has of a Toa Hero when they gain the powers of one. Or if they were built in a specific image (like the Toa Mata).
That was solely because I thought you were being serious. You can’t write something provocative and expect everyone to immediately assume you’re joking.
Also I hear people talking about the polls to continue/discontinue the contests being unnecessary because the vote was overwhelmingly for the former. A few things on that:
I don’t, I’m writing this from my deathbed while writting my will. (This is a joke btw not dying just really drained by these contest and recent events) these contests have been mentally draining for everyone involved and I just want it over with so I can sorta rest in peace for another 6 months.
I would say look at the sets, If you look at all canon Bionicle toa models so far - Krakua they all for example have shorter upper legs than lower legs. They feature a supriseingly high ratio of hunchbacks and some of them have gorilla arms but generally the proportions of the arm follows the legs proportion.
Maybe you should reconsider whether or not following these contests are worth the amount of stress you get out of it, then.
Yee and let just whatever get canon, not a chance. I wish the contest were better at regulating what can be entered in general maybe then I could stop careing so much as I’d be more likely to end up not minding the winners as much. However backing out of them isn’t an option whether or not you want to believe it this contest affects the entire community either way.
Besides all prior contest organized by lego always specified to build you moc using parts from your Bionicle collection. I don’t see how that rule isn’t relevant here?