lol i could dig mystery teases for like a couple months yeah. it been a while and i just at this point having watched a 3 hour interview with him giving no real answers imma just enjoy my good guy has a name now memes and chill
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Not everyone has to like every piece of media. For example, I’m not going to ask Faber to change Rebel Nature just because I don’t like the human aspect.
*Laughs in decade-old unfinished G1 serials *
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i mean with the serials greg has at least been pretty clear that without approval from someone higher up than him at lego that aint getting finished. but yeah serials went well lmao
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That… Misses the point of my argument, and distracts from what I’m saying. Crypticness is not inherently wrong, nor do I dislike crypticness generally. What I’m saying is, when you are promoting something like Biovival, eventually the audience, to whom Faber is trying to gather, wants an answer. And so far he once again is leading us in circles. I suppose some have the patience for that. I once did. I’m starting to lose that patience.
Guess what? I’m annoyed by that too! But I have given up on them because G1 is dead and buried. (Save for fan efforts, but none of that is official.)
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NOVEL INCOMING
If someone is arguing that Faber has promised us a product then the onus would be on them to prove as much. I have established, time and again, that I do not believe Faber promised a product nor has my argument against him ever been predicated on such. If it ever was, the onus would be on me to prove as much.
However if you have specific quotes from the interview that refute someone’s statement of such, would it not also be beneficial to you to quote those, rather than essentially going “I’m right, Do your research?”
Because the former is a hallmark of good discussion. The latter is some Anti-Vaxxer Facebook Mom Karen screaming into the void how no one else has done the research.
If you have the information to back up your point, use it. Directing others to a 3 hour long interview in order to refute their point would be the equivalent of me saying “When I say I don’t agree with Faber’s use of social media, I say so because of the following 6 Marketing Textbooks and the Bachelor of Commerce Degree Program at my University. I think you’ll find if you read them and take the course that you will agree with me.”
Great - So we can all agree that his instagram posts where he specifically tells people that stuff is coming are potentially misleading, especially since most of them never panned out and it’s been well over a year? Because you’re so fixated on one offhand mention of a “product” that you’re willing to dismiss or otherwise ignore every instance of Faber making reference to future plans. Posts like:
(Oh would you look at that, “14B2020 Virtual Film Production” sounds like a potential product to me.)
“Focused on teasing a dream”
“Dear fans of the Biological Chronicle…”
Whaddaya know there’s plenty of posts on Faber’s instagram that suggest he was or is aiming to make a product. Oh, and would you look at that, he has actually asked fans to get involved without… any direction of how they might do so asides:
“We the community are going to make things happen, supported or not.”
Now before you raise your pitchfork, understand that I am simply pointing out instances where Faber has included some form of Call to Action on his feed, or otherwise implied that he has a future goal. While these don’t necessarily correlate to the situation today, to say that Faber has never asked for anything, support or otherwise, from the fanbase is simply false. The vast majority of arguments that have been made have been, at least to my understanding, primarily calling out Faber’s habit of using calls to action to imply some sort of event or big project which then, to this day, never got expanded upon. What’s all this talk about the “next chapter,” and having your work included, if not the promotion of project that he wants community support and involvement with? Is it then so unreasonable to be annoyed that he teased “The next chapter” for months before going radio silent? More importantly, how does fan-made content relate to these pitches you’re so certain he’s making behind the scenes, when to use it would be illegal?
I have, let me reiterate one last time, zero expectation that Faber is going to release a product. My opinion of Faber’s work until this point has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not he is releasing a product, and whether I am “entitled” to something or not. Instead, it revolves solely around my opinion of his Instagram messaging and how it has been demonstrably misleading at times. It is a genuine criticism born from Evidence, not from being a spoilt brat whos expectations weren’t met by a random guy on the internet.
As for the greater “Who’s supposed to provide evidence” I think that Jerminator has done a fantastic job of doing exactly what you should have done before resorting to personal attacks. Consider the fact that earlier in this very topic you were content to refute every point I made solely because I hadn’t mentioned that I follow Faber’s instagram, as though that alone enables me to criticize him and his public social media presence.
I don’t follow Rooster Teeth anymore either, doesn’t stop me from being able to criticize what they’ve done or how they handled things.
Let me be perfectly clear. I, too, am content to see where it goes with Faber. My main issue is solely that his cryptic posting and leading people on came to a head a few weeks ago and the comments Faber made as a result were decidedly the wrong way to handle things and have rubbed me the wrong way. I have significantly less strong feelings for Faber than I do the people constantly asserting that the only way you can be critical of or dislike how Faber’s handling things at this time is if you are ultimately an immature, entitled, child. All I ever wanted, and continue to want, is clarity from Faber. Because I am interested in what he’s doing, but I also want to know what his actual plans are, especially when it comes to getting the fandom involved. Does he want to just inspire people to make cool artwork? Great, we’ve been doing that 20 years, mission accomplished. Does he want to develop a product and use us as a benchmark for interest? Great, go ahead and do that as long as you’re clear about what your intent long-term is. because while I’ll support Bionicle coming back with virtually no information about how, I’ll be less likely to support , say, rolling Bionicle into the Rebel Nature universe and story without a solid amount of information about how it’ll be done.
Faber has offered some clarity via that interview, but not enough to dispel every criticism levied towards him. Would I like more info? Sure. Am I content to wait for it, as long as Faber abstains from getting too cryptic and/or poor reactions to fans like we saw a few weeks ago? Absolutely.
Exactly. But you’d also be annoyed if Rebel Nature was teased as the new Bionicle and it wasn’t until years from now when it was about to launch that you learned the main character would be Human. Knowing they’re human now means you have a better idea of what to expect. keeping things cryptic for longer and longer increases the chance of not just disappointment, but actual focused anger.
As Cronk Said:
This is not an unreasonable stance to take. Everyone has different risk aversion, everyone has different levels of patience for unclear things, everyone has a point where they are, ultimately, well within their rights to feel a certain way. If people feel strung along by Faber, or just don’t agree with how he’s been doing things, they are well within their rights to feel that way. Just as everyone supporting him is well within their right to do so.
When it falls apart is when people have their arguments misrepresented, or people stop actually reading because the other person is on “the other team” which is something that, at least to me, has been happening a fair amount in this topic specifically. Like Faber, don’t like Faber, like Biovival, don’t like Biovival, the choice is yours. This discussion topic exists to discuss Biovival. If anyone tries to deny there’s a lot of Biovival to discuss… well, we all know that’s not true. Sadly, that means the discussion revolves around Faber more than it revolves around his project, but ultimately the only person who can fix that is Faber.
I wish he would, sooner than later. But for now, I’m content to wait, because he’s at least demonstrated that he does in fact have a goal that is connected to the project, however abstract it is. The fact that Faber was willing to get on call means infinitely more to my opinion of him and the validity of his cryptic Insta posts than any post itself ever could, and so i’ll give him the benefit of the doubt.
For now.
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that’s not just a novel. That’s Brandon Sanderson level length.
except that I don’t take psychic damage when I read it
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yeah i coulda sworn he was typing for like a half hour lol
Was tempted to post a gif of Kini trying to run and catch up to the posts that were outpacing him lol. Still a good thread.
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Me Erry Time:
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Plugs ears as the bomb is about to go off.
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i am simply innocent monke who likes my plastic robot people. im too young to die
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Honestly I’ve gotta say this has just been a tad depressing. I was hoping Faber might actually say what it is that he’s doing, whether that’s the proposed theory of a VR experience or whatever, but to hear him just waffle on in the same way he has been for the past two years now was just… He had the platform, and… he didn’t use it? He wants to inspire creatives, okay… what does that mean though. He’s preparing the people for mystery, for an exploration. We’re being lead onto a ship and we can’t know the destination.
Is it an island though? Is it a planet? Or are we just getting tossed into the sea.
I don’t think Faber is a charlatan, I think he genuinely wants to benefit this community with whatever he’s doing, but this whole song and dance is getting incredibly weary for me.
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too young, but not too innocent.
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didnt you hear, you have to just get on into the water yourself lmao
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Anyone else have the countdown sound effect from 24 playing in their heads?
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Thank you. I do not disagree with your position there.
Ghid’s position is along those lines, which is why I was disagreeing with him, not you.
Your post about burden of proof being with those who had watched the video made me think that you considered the burden of proof to be on me (or others) to negate someone Ghid’s claim, rather than on him to supply evidence.
It would, but I don’t have any. Nowhere in the interview does Faber explicitly say “I don’t have a product right now”.
But by listening to extended sections of said interview, particularly the first 30 mins or so (as both I and Jerminator have linked in the past), you can understand the development stage he is at, which is one preceding a product existing.
To be clear, I do think Faber wants to bring product(s) of some sort into existence in the future and is working towards that.
I’ve been disagreeing with people who say that those products already exist and therefore should be revealed.
We probably agree on both those points.
Maybe not, but Covid has slowed things down.
As I quoted from the interview, he isn’t set up yet to receive fan submissions to his project, so I find it unlikely that he would be using them in pitches already.
I’m genuinely sorry if it came off this way. But this is a complete misinterpretation of my argument from last (?) week.
I doubt either of us want to get into it again, but just to clear things up:
- We had a discussion about whether people are “entitled” to something from Faber.
- IIRC you suggested by giving your “support” you could be.
- I thought giving “support” didn’t amount to anything concrete, because you didn’t explain what you meant by it for several posts.
- You then gave the example of following his Instagram, which I am happy to accept is concrete and refuted those particular points I had made.
I hope it doesn’t seem like I am one of the people not reading things. Personally I read every word, but I try to keep my responses from ballooning massively, so I try to condense my points and try not to be jumping in every day.
If I’ve ever misrepresented someone’s position, it’s because I’ve misunderstood their post, not out of malice. It’s easy to do - there are almost as many different pro- and anti-Faber positions on here as there are commenters. (And I mean no offense, but your post here misrepresents my points as I explain above, for example.)
I happily agree with this sentiment. Hopefully this essay comes across with the positive tone it has in my head. 
Edit: Oof, this looks much longer than I thought it was now I’ve pressed “send”. 
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I think the issue is that if Faber is still working out the kinks on what the product will be, then he should just say so.
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I’m listening
This, but with the alteration that In my opinion Faber’s practically sold the concept of an end product at this point before we know what it is he’s selling. Were his concept to be nothing more than an additional blog, I’m not going to be upset because I really don’t care that much. But I’m still of the opinion that Faber’s more or less done just that towards his audience and he’s going to need to do some clarifying - real fast, at that - if he wants to retain this following he’s received.
Whether or not you share that is really arguing over semantics ( I know, that coming from me right now is pretty rich) when the real problem both in the argument and for Christian Faber is what his audience thinks will happen. If 50% of people react the way I worry they may, Faber will lose 50% of his fanbase. And to say 50% of the people aware of Biovival are hyped for a new Bionicle is hardly an unfair assumption.
That, for the record, is not my stance.
Since Christian Faber has broken the process of how product design works in some fashion - undeniably he has if he hasn’t conducted business meetings beforehand - he’s made promises in relation to a maybe product clearly before said maybe product even exists or is remotely finalized. And many people are going to be upset by not receiving a product they were teased with, if a product is on the way at all.
A scary thought: could Faber not have an idea finalized on what he’s doing? Could this cryptic hopscotch be him trying to determine what to do?
I’m not supporting this idea, but for the sake of not retreading arguments I’m presenting it. Lots of “I’d like to do” and “thinking about”… Is that why he won’t say anything?
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OK, sorry for the misunderstanding. I still disagree with
but I don’t mean to misrepresent you by summarising your ideas incorrectly.
For a change, let me agree with you on this:
In the interview, at 46:01, Faber talks about wanting to take community direction on the story at least. He suggests that whether Biovival is a reimagining of G1, or something new, could be up to the community once he gets things going.
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