Power in G2

cracks knuckles

  1. You can clearly see his head is being knocked back and whilst that is happening, Ekimu jumps and swings his hammer. Before Kulta can react, thud, he has a hammer in his face. He does not have enough time to react. He is watching as pellets fly at him in shock and once again doesn't get a chance to react

  2. He has.probably been thwarted in his attempts. And this topic is NOT about skill, it is about power

  3. How so? It is a legitimate example (I Goodman business now)

  4. Skill does NOT equal power

  5. BECAUSE THIS TOPIC ISN'T ABOUT SKILL!!!!

  6. As I pointed out before, they're literally the elements, they have your prolonged point, skill and are in their element. A very huge advantage. He does indeed catch a creature, Ketar, and that doesn't mean your powers don't make you powerful cos you can't hunt something down. His powers make him powerful.

  7. Being a skilled warrior doesn't grow you a pair of eyes in the back of your head you know. His power is still not.greater, he has strength. Umarak has probably substantial strength, shadow blending abilities and probably others. These are powerful. Plus the MoCr is not Kulta's power at all, therefore it does not count.

  8. BUT EKIMU ISN'T MORE POWERFUL, WE ARE ON ABOUT POWER. In which he is inferior to both Kulta, Umarak, the Creatures and the Toa. Skill certainly, power no

But I must say Tarvaax you have opened my eyes to the true story, I never knew Kulta wore the MoCo :wink:

Thank you @Triple at least someone gets that point, it is an important one. I never thought about the Toa holding him in place, but indeed they do. Also, who wouldn't be surprised if they opened their eyes and saw a small gold guy swinging a hammer at them after literally blasting their face in 5 seconds earlier

"Umarak and his effectiveness at catching the creatures is questionable. Although he is stated to have been created during the formation of Okoto we don't know how long he has actually been active."

Once again however that is not a measure of power by any means. Look at topict title, Tarvaax

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Well,

You We humans have hands fit more for high dexterity than hurting. Yet we train ourselves to make them hurt anyway. We've even created a whole variety of styles for doing it in the form of Martial Arts. Skill may not equal strength, but I do think skill is a component in overall power.

However, Ekimu isn't pulling any Karate power during the fight. He runs up, jumps, and swings before Kulta can swing his mace as we can see him doing.

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In a way yes, but the definition of power in which we are talking about is: "physical strength and force exerted by something or someone." So in the end skill is not power.
And really, Kulta was quite powerful but lacked in the skill department, hence defeat. Against the inexperienced Toa he did great Against Ekimu, no.

This is mainly important cos it started as an argument between me and Tarvaax as to whether Ekimu was more powerful than Kulta. Then he said yeah and that Kulta was more powerful than Umarak, which I did not agree with. So then I asked why Ekimu didn't just fight Umarak then and why bother with unity. It then went from there.

So I created this topic as I wanted to know others opinions and to stop it cluttering the 2016 discussion topic

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Batman wins, your argument is invalid.

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You forget that your "power" when wielding a weapon is a bit of strength mixed with varied skill. The more skillful you are, the more powerful and deadly you are with that weapon.

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Power is the physical strength or force exerted, in the context in which we are applying it. Skill does not affect that.

Ekimu uses his skill to defeat more powerful opponents, but he is not more powerful himself

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Only cos Kulta was surprised (I feel like I've been arguing this before). And skill, NOT power.

So Kulta is more.powerful but has less skill. He was also surprised. All this = defeat. But he was still more powerful

You keep on throwing around the words "Skill does not equal Power" and while this is true, it does affect it. The type of power you keep talking about is Raw Power, being the sum of their physical strength. However, you claim to be interested in who would win in a fight, and for that you would want to look at Applied Power, being the combination of how much Raw Power they have and how they use it.

The weight of a mountain is far greater than the force of the wind, but over time the wind will erode the mountain away. It doesn't matter how much power you have, if you don't know how to use it, it's absolutely worthless. You can say that skill has nothing to do with it all you want, but the fact of the matter is that it is just as valid as any other point here.

Don't get me wrong, I agree with your rankings. Kulta is definitely more powerful than Ekimu, and, based on the little information we have, Umarak appears to be more powerful than the both.

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I know skill adds to power, but that's in retaliation to people saying Ekimu is more powerful because of skill. He does have more skill than Kulta, but Kulta more than makes up for that in raw power.

The only reason Ekimu really won was his luck, not skill, by surprising Kulta

The ability to speedup time and see through time, travel has neither been hinted at or stated. The protectors used the MoT to speed up the alignment of the planets, because it was prophesied that when they align the Toa would arrive.

Now that I'm done being that guy, Ekimu did catch him off guard. It is specifically stated that "Ekimu darted towards the startled skull Grinder". Even then, all Ekimu did was hit a mask off skull grinder. We know when they lose their masks they are weakened. Skull Slicer just yanked the mask off Lewa, same with Pohatu and the Scorpio. All that happened was Kulta didn't react fast enough to prevent Ekimu from taking the mask. Hitting a mask off someone's face with a hammer isn't a good representation of someone's power. Skull Grinders instant collepse was probably only because his jaw was smashed in with a hammer (of power) and the fact solid gold would have scraped against his face.

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I know, and I am not disagreeing with that fact. I am simply saying that you need to stop dismissing skill, because it is a relevant factor. Yes, Ekimu's skill is not the reason he won. Skill doesn't really have much to do with that fight, but it is relevant in other comparisons being made on this topic.

I don't dismiss skill, it was just Tarvaax kept on saying Ekimu won because of skill. Which we agree he didn't.

Okay, this is what I'm thinking:

Ekimu has two sources of great power: the Mask of Creation and his Hammer of Power. These two artifacts seem to be on similar power levels over 9000 which was how Ekimu was able to effectively combat Kulta. I'm thinking the reason Ekimu won was because Kulta was at least a little tired after beating the snot out of the Toa, and he wasn't expecting an elderly dwarf to fight back.

Then there's Umarak, an ancient being dating back to the creation of Okoto. We know he's thousands of years old, but age does not necessarily equate to skill. As far as we know, Umarak could have been locked up for all this time, and by some doing of Makuta, he's been freed, either to buy Makuta time or bring Makuta the Mask of Control back.

Also, for headcanon and fanfic reasons, Umarak might not be from Okoto, he just came into being the same time as the island did.

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So who do you think is more powerful?

With the MoCr and HoP, Ekimu, definitely. He's a tiny lil powerhouse of gold and water (or something).

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Umarak can hide in the shadows though

We have also have no evidence the MoCr makes Ekimu stronger, we only saw it do that on Kulta

I don't think that's ever been stated in official media yet. Either way, that's not really comparable to being able to take out an entire team of Toa in one fell swoop (Kulta was only able to do that with the MoCr on, and the HoP is likely comparable in strength to the MSS).

Ok, I still believe Umarak is stronger though

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Same here, Kulta's just a flimsy puppet under control, while Umarak is a hunter capturing elemental creatures...

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