The limbs under the armor being just as frail, the hoses implemented, the same piece used as the mace, and the use of Mata as opposed to Metru blue. Not even looking at the Pakari. It’s got that “this puny guy got ripped in three weeks, here’s how” kind of vibe.
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Well the art portion of the contest exists primarily to determine the appearance of the Kanohi. Most of the characters on the list will not even have art contest (or if they will, it will be mixed up with MOC entries, I guess we shall see in the future).
The point is one would expect a MOC to win a MOC contest because… well it is a good MOC. Not because of the art people will make after the fact.
You don’t win running competitions because you can jump really high in the jumping competition taking place the day after.
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One, comparing an election based on public approval to a skill-based competition based on personal achievement is already not valid. Two, the contest already stated in the rules that both the MOC and the art itself would be presented to Greg.
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Are contests in creating MOCs and artwork not skill-based?
Is your creation you enter into the contest not your personal achievement?
I am not denying that.
There is a difference. To win a race, one pushes oneself. They do not win because the audience deems them the winner, they win because they push themselves to win and, through their own skill and training, beat out their opponents. The win is earned by the person themselves.
In an election, the power to bestow the win, the power to make the winner, does not lie in those competing. It lies with the audience, as regardless of how much one has trained, they can still dislike you or your methods and not vote for you. That is the difference between a contest based on votes, and one based on trials and tribulations.
As for my other point, the contest rules were that both the MOC and the Art would be presented, and that the Art would be the main canon depiction. These rules were made before the contest began. To change them now just because you dislike the one that won would be wrong.
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Good news, everyone: We were able to complete our audit sooner than we anticipated. We will release the final results at the top of the hour.
Once again, thank you all for your patience.
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Will you make a new topic or post them here?
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New topic.
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Understood. I’ll be very surprised if somehow a whole 3% of votes was alt accounted, but you guys did say you’d be as fair as possible to vet accounts with the exact IP, so I suppose there’s nothing to do now but wait.
Thank you for spending your time on such a thing though. The effort is appreciated.
Ok, but that is not important for the point I am trying to make. I can use election for my analogy if you think that suits it better:
Lets say people are voting to determine the best architect to lead a certain project. I think it is reasonable to expect people voting their favorites based on their skills, abilities and achievements in the considered area of expertise (architecture), and not based on something unrelated like being a good salesman.
This contest wasn’t really skill-based, though. If build quality and the personal achievement with the medium were what mattered, we’d have a very different top six.
In reality we all just picked favourites, and the criteria upon which we chose those favourites differed from person to person. Some chose based on pure MOC quality. Some picked what was the best fit to the description provided. Some picked what spoke to them personally.
Because of this, some entries that fit the description perfectly were eliminated early. Some that didn’t match at all went deep and even reached the last round. Some great MOCs made it to the end. Some didn’t escape Round 1.
But regardless, I can’t call it a skill-based contest when this was the winning entry:
I’m not about to argue as to whether Hoseryx is a good MOC or not. If you think it is, great, more power to you. But does it demonstrate the most skill with the medium? No. And that’s not a bad thing, mind. I’m of the opinion that skill and fancy techniques are secondary to accuracy, and I’m happy to have a more simple MOC that represents the character of Helryx accurately. That’s why I didn’t vote for Daedryx past Round 1. Great MOC, amazing techniques, not really a Toa. But the fact that Round 3 wasn’t filled with the more fantastical, intricate takes, proves that skill wasn’t all that mattered.
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Dupe accounts are not the sole factor in auditing. Every account of every entry was examined.
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That makes sense. However, oftentimes presentation is what matters as well. If there is an election to find the greatest architect of churches, and we have 6 contestants show up, five of them excellent depictions of houses and one that depicts a simple church, and that one also manages to inspire more churches and church related ideas, then the win could go to them. Elections are based on the skill and abilities of the person, yes, but the same as how they can be based on unrelated achievements (people voting because they like the builder), they could be won by presentation. There have been many elections where the candidate who was not as good as another simply was able to win the hearts of the audience through spokesmanship.
The example is sort of falling apart now though, admittedly.
@ToaArcan I too do not think it was skill based. And you are right in how people chose their entries. But you also must consider that what you consider “great”, another might not. Many people felt Entry 5 was the best choice, but I did not.
It is true that it does not demonstrate the most skill in the medium. But in my eyes, I am alright with that, because I felt that the most important thing was fulfilling the criteria well.
@TenebraeInvictus How so? If someone voted, and their account was made legitimately, then they should have the right to vote, should they not?
They would not be breaking any rules, and they would be voting fairly. Even if they are not TTV regulars, they still voted.
I’d like to make a few points that I don’t think have been made yet (though admittedly I just skimmed the last day of posts in about 5 minutes):
If there exist bad canonical sets, that’s not a good reason to add more bad canonical sets.
Also, I quite like some of the allegedly-bad sets.
Furthermore, this is a contest amongst grown-up fans who can do better than the 7-13-year-olds who entered the Dark Hunters contest.
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TTV regulars or not was is not what we were looking for. There are plenty of those who are just fine. That doesn’t mean there were not accounts that voted for the only reason to tamper with the outcome of any entry. There are different factors we assessed about each of these but ultimately everyone was evaluated the same way.
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It doesn’t seem fair for people to have to bace potentially multiple art contests if the current winner gets rejected in favor of the runner-up.
That goes not for Helryx, but every other character in the contest
How would that even be decided?
If someone came to the site to vote, how would you be able to tell their intentions? If they explicitly said “man I don’t care about the vote I’m voting because I was bribed”, then yes I understand, but if someone, for instance, told their neighbor that they liked the entry and encouraged them to make an account and vote, then how would one tell?
What other issue, beyond duplicate accounts, could warrant a vote being removed?
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I’m not open to discussing the exact specifics, as Eljay has already said we’re not looking for people to find workarounds based on what we say. I feel that we are confident and honest in how we examined everyone.
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Users with silly names would be a questionable standard to decipher if they were just there for tampering. Where does the line go, besides the obvious obscene names.
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I’d assume they took it on a case by case basis? idk.
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