Jaller's Sword(s) Citation

I’ve been meaning to mention this for a while, but I believe the assertion on Jaller’s BS01 page that he had two Flame Swords needs amending, or citation.

The only time the swords are referred to in plural is BA7. The reasoning given on BS01 is that Greg was writing based on the prototype as the final model hadn’t been completed. Except this is the second book of 2007, the Inika had already been out for a good while, and all of the actual 2006 novels had the details correct, so this doesn’t make sense (it’s literally his last Inika appearance).

The above rationale has no citation on BS01 (which if you know anything about BS01, is rare).

Therefore, I wonder if it was either just a writing error that was immediately taken to be canon, or if the Mahri prototype that had two swords, and if Greg got them mixed up in writing BA7. At the least, we need a citation added to BS01 for why Jaller is referred to having two swords in one book after a whole year of matching the set.

If I have missed anything, please do let me know. If there is conclusive evidence to back up the ‘two swords’ issue, then it needs to be added to BS01. If not, I think it should be reverted back to a single sword.

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I don’t know about the prototype bit. Should prob put a Citation needed on it. As for him actually having two swords:
https://greg.thegreatarchives.com/2003-2008/page299#post11942
If no one does it before me, I’ll add this later today.

ps. This is what BS01 talk pages are for :stuck_out_tongue:

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Ah, thanks @Wolk, that’s really helpful. I thought about using the talk page, but I felt kinda paranoid, like ‘surely someone must have raised this before?’

Nice I already asked the same thing years ago, but I haven’t gotten an answer. Both the Makuta’s Guide, BionicleStory.com and the Encyclopedia says Jaller had 1 energized flame sword too.
Jaller Inika: Sword or Swords?

The story of BIONICLE was planned a few years in advance. It’s likely Greg was writing BA7 before or during the release of the 2006 sets, and that the discrepancy with the swords wasn’t noticed or corrected by the time the book was released.

Please, BL7 was the Invasion book at first, which meant to be the 2nd book of 2007, but is was scrapped and Greg had to write the Prisoners of the Pit instead of it, which meant that the original story got shortened from 2 books to 1. And all the books up to BL7, where Jaller had his sword, which is 5 books (because in bl1 he isn’t a Toa yet) + several magazines, comic books said he only had 1 sword all the time. And literally every other media after BL7 said he had 1 Energized Flame Sword, like the BIONICLEstory.com, the Encyclopedia Updated, and the Makuta’s Guide to the Universe. It is very unlikely that Greg had to write a story about the Toa Inika’s transformation into Toa Mahri in 2005 where only prototypes existed, and guess what? Every Jaller Inika prototype images we actually have shows Jaller with only 1 sword, no matter if it is an earlier one, or the “Igniters” prototype.

I mean, I’m not sure what you’re trying to insinuate here–that because we only have images of Jaller prototypes with one sword, Greg isn’t telling the truth that there was once one that had two?

I don’t know the full details behind the situation, obviously, but this is what Greg remembers. At the very least, it was a simple mistake on his part. Prototypes go through many designs, and we don’t get the chance to see many of them.

The problem isn’t that Greg would be wrong - it’s that we don’t have any record of him saying anything about a prototype in the first place.

On the other hand, we know from several posts on BZP that the books, comics, podcasts, serials, etc. weren’t made that long before release. From Greg’s Blog we know BL6 (released in the year end between 2006 and 2007) was finished May 29th, 2006. So about 7 months before-hand, where as ignition comic 3 was finished around June 24th 2006 (though behind schedule) and released - I believe - through the July 1st issue of the LEGO Magazine, being finished only about a week before hand. And as seen with The Powers That Be & The Yesterday Quest in regards to serials, no further chapters exist upon the release of the latest.

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The story of BIONICLE was planned a few years in advance. It’s likely Greg was writing BA7 before or during the release of the 2006 sets, and that the discrepancy with the swords wasn’t noticed or corrected by the time the book was released.

You said that, and it makes no sense because of the timephrase, as if he made a typo in BL2, which is the first appearance of the toa inika, and you would defend it with saying that above, I’d say okay. But the Toa inika were released in 2006, while the book, BL7 (not BA7, Web of the Visorak has nothing to do with the Inika), what has the 2 swords thing in it, was released in 2007 a full year after the Toa Inika were at the stores. It’s like if the Glatorian had used zamor launchers in a 2010 comic, and the artist would say he used the prototypes from late 2008 for reference. I said he only described Inika Jaller having 2 swords in 2007, for 1 summer-released book, 2 times. All the other books prior that, which is 5 bionicle legends books, and all the other books after that implies that Jaller only had 1 Energized Flame Sword, and just for the sake of fun, even in BL7 Jaller was described having 1 sword up to the point where it was said he has 2. But before it was mentioned that Jaller lit up his swords on page 9, Jaller used one sword to attack the Zyglak on page 5. The page doesn’t says one of his swords, it says Jaller fired a blast of fire from his sword. To me, it implies that Jaller had one sword at the moment, as it is his first appearance in the book.

More accurately, the book’s release date is unrelated - The book was written in May 2006, and the Toa Inika sets would have been released that summer. Nonetheless, in all likelyhood, the sets were already finalized by then, as it was only about 2? months before their release. However, Greg may not have had access to the finalized designs. It is however, of course, odd that the Legends 1-3 and 5 do not make mention of this second sword.

Every Jaller Inika prototype images we actually have shows Jaller with only 1 sword, no matter if it is an earlier one, or the “Igniters” prototype.

It’s certainly possible Jaller had two swords in a later stage of the prototypes which we have not seen. Who’s to say they didn’t decide to add two swords closer in time to the final product, and only reverted him back to having one sword late in production? If Greg was writing based off of a prototype, it would not have been the ‘Die Toa Inika’ that we’ve seen, as they are extremely different in their weaponry from the final sets - not having Zamor launchers for one, the other Toa having completely different sets of tools, and the organic mask idea did not seem to have been a thing yet either at that stage. The prototypes changing could explain why he did not have two swords in the earlier books if it was a late addition, and subsequentially, a late decision to revert it.

I don’t see any reason the line on BS01 would have been fabricated. More likely, there’s simply a source we haven’t found yet - but on the other hand from the quote I found it sounds more like he just gave him two swords because. (Or made a typo and rolled with it?).

EDIT:
Besides the aforementioned quote, here’s all the references to it I could find the archive (all of which are later than the first quote):
https://greg.thegreatarchives.com/2003-2008/page302#post12070-line6,14
https://greg.thegreatarchives.com/2008-2010/page1#post37-line25,48
https://greg.thegreatarchives.com/2008-2010/page17#post658-line19,20
https://greg.thegreatarchives.com/2008-2010/page205#post8188-line7,13
https://greg.thegreatarchives.com/2008-2010/page270#post10796-line10,20
https://greg.thegreatarchives.com/2013-2017/page916#post14643368-line5,14

Particularily I find the third one of note, which also bring up Nuparu Mahri’s sword: “It was decided while I was writing.”

For the Aqua Blaster Blade, we do have a source however:
https://greg.thegreatarchives.com/2003-2008/page265#post10568-line2,7

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Everyone is assuming this is Greg’s mistake. Maybe it was bs01’s? Maybe whoever put that trivia up “remembered” Greg saying something he hadn’t actually said?

Well, at least there is a catalogue that mentions Nuparu’s Aqua Blaster Blade, but every magazine I’ve seen and read mentions Jaller having 1 sword, even the Inika website too.

Yeah, that’s all I have found back then too, I even mentioned it on the swords talkpage. I don’t like the “because I needed him to have 2” answer, but that’s the first quote from him… not to mention that it makes no sense, as he used both the swords for light sources, not one for fight and one for being a light source

@Racie02 It wouldn’t be the first time actually, there were several answers which were just partually added and by adding the rest of the answer made everything cleaner.