[Poll] What if Bionicle was a System Theme?

I would give you one thing though, its that the fans would come up with more interesing ideas for story and sets than something that LEGO would (even if accounting the limitations of set cost, price ration, thematic, playability role).

Add: Thats why they hired previously only fans of Bionicle to work on the design of the newer sets, they have a closer understanding of what the line and characters are about to translate it all best for other similar fans. I mean, the concept art and the sets (all done by Bionicle fans of old), have been one of the very few positives about this Gen, all cause they have that fan spark of care.

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All fair concerns that are difficult to dismiss. Lego hasn’t exactly given me a lot of faith in their ability to handle BIONICLE’s story in a way that is befitting of its legacy. My main hope would just be that, if it was given a System theme and treated as a “Big Bang” for the year, it would receive enough attention and care to ensure that it didn’t fall below expectations in its core areas. That’s in sharp contrast to it staying a purely constraction theme, where I’m pretty confident that it would never receive the attention it needs due to constraction being such an extreme after-thought.

I look forward to discussing this on TTV and maybe figuring out some creative solutions to these valid issues.

-Mesonak

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What if Lego just uses ball joints like in constraction but uses the brick connections instead for BIONICLE? Wouldn’t that work better? Just make a few pieces to use for limbs, and there you have it. You don’t have to use CCBS for a constraction line. You can use System as well.

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Hmm if Lego did BOTH constraction AND System for Bionicle would the Constraction line have relevance to the plot and actually give people a REASON to buy the sets or would it just haphazardly put the “Ultrabuild” version of the characters somewhere in the show with very little significance to the overall story?

Like with Chima all we got was a silly silhouette and a few various points in the show where the ultrabuilds were more surreal rather than something present and despite how well done the sets were and interesting, they didn’t sell because NO ONE had any REASON to buy them which was a shame tbh. Because I got in to Chima only because of the Ultrabuilds not the System sets. I’d hate to see Bionicle go that route too, because honestly I think the system and the constraction sets should either be tied together to encourage sales for both lines or just focus on a constraction only (or system only theme). And in the case of Bionicle I think the appeal is that they are action figures first and foremost and the only way Bionicle could work as a system line and draw appeal as these warrior heroes to kids would be either through Mixel joints or CCBS/Technic. I think the majority of most system themes success such as Ninjago and Nexo Knights are the vehicles, which give the minifigures something to interact with and if Bionicle went system I can’t see them really doing that, I can only see them making playsets which is something I think would be either too expensive to the buyers for LEGO to make consistent waves of and profit off of or too lackluster for anyone to buy (if they tried to cut the cost of the set down).

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Though a system line may be successful for Bionicle, its current reputation as a product that sits on shelves collecting dust won’t make the retailers confident in stocking it. And though a “G3” would be nice, I don’t see it happening anyway. And I feel that the best thing for Bionicle minifigures would be something similar to the Mega Bloks Halo figures. However due to the cost of molding a completely new minifigure anatomy and the possibility of a lawsuit from MB, I don’t see it happening.

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I feel as though Bionicle Gen 3 would be most successful if it had both elements, with my primary evidence being Knights Kingdom (the second version according to Wikipedia) which existed from 2004 to 2006.

The characters in this line were represented the best as contraction based builds with the articulation being less than the standard Inika builds. While they all were essentially clone sets they still had personality due to their color scheme and arrangement of certain parts, not to mention their distinctive prints. The system sets of this theme both included vehicles (ships, battering rams, etc.) and what I believe Bionicle lacked in both generations, an actual view of the landscape, with several castles, and buildings being released. And all the characters (with the exception of generic bag-guy knights for the first 2 years) were included in both divisions of system and contraction. The theme had around 5 books, a video game, and even a collectible card game and was, I believe, a great success. The only reason I believe it failed was due to the success of an even better theme - Bionicle!

Now a lot has changed since then; obviously the love of contraction has declined somewhat and some sacrifices, I believe, must be made to save the Bionicle franchise at one point or another. With the essential “failure” of Gen 2, the only way to restore the magic of our beloved theme would be to enter the massive world of system.

I think the main issue Bionicle had for both generations would be the use of giant specialized pieces, but nowadays Lego has gotten much better. I like the idea of the system sets from gen one, but I really really dislike the giant mask references that they slapped everywhere! It was crazy! I’m sure that if Lego just repeated the essential pattern that they did with Knights Kingdom, Bionicle would actually be a success. We would get both cool, articulated contraction figures and awesome playsets with neat looking buildings and such. And let’s be realistic, it doesn’t really matter if we get a few monster trucks or race cars - the concept of elemental vehicles might actually appeal to a wider audience!

I’m not saying that I like elemental vehicles (I would much prefer landscapes and buildings) but we shouldn’t just rule it out! Lego might give us awesome build-able Gen 3 rahi instead!

(Something that I actually plan to do on my version of Gen 3, here, which is a work in progress) shameless advertising, I know :sweat_smile:

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Hmm… thinking of Knight’s kingdom and getting castles and the like, I now have visions of a brick-built Forge of the Mask-Makers, Temple of Time, various Temples and Ruins in which the toa find their masks (all of these things are from G2, by the way, with my mental picture including IFB minifigs).

I almost feel like trying to build them…

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Exactly.

All these epic locations that you just stated would look great as system sets! Not everything has to be vehicles, as some people fear.

They wouldn’t have to be vehicles, but based on the current ‘climate’ of Lego builds, we would most likely get a bunch of colorful vehicles. D:

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ReeseEH nailed it! Yah I’d love a lot of Mini playsets and things like that but the current trend for LEGO right now is vehicles over playsets (yes Ninjago, Superheroes etc do have playsets but the majority of sets released are vehicles and mechs.)

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As if megablocks would, or could sue lego. Making small figures with “standard” points of articulation isnt patented by MegaBlocks. Specific molds and the general outline of MB figures are patented but not the general idea. All lego would have to do is take the current minifigure form and create a more articulate figure in the same style.

Not to mention the fact that MB rips molds off from lego contantly.

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While I prefer Bionicle as a constraction theme and feel that the characters are best portrayed through CCBS and Technic, I am open to it becoming a system theme (unfortunately there wasn’t a “No, but yes” option).

That being said, I would still want contraction figures to be released alongside their system counterparts. The reason being: I like detailed sets. Unfortunately with system, the size and current standard of a minifigure does not allow for as much detail and articulation as Bionicle’s previous runs; something that I feel added a lot to the theme. I agree with JonBlueFire and feel that taking the approach that Knights’ Kingdom V2 took would be the best way to go if this were the case. I would love to see detailed landscape, architectural and vehicular system sets with Bionicle minifigures as well as constraction versions of the very same characters,creatures and vehicles. I feel to accomplish this LEGO would need to release a substantial amount of Bionicle sets; meaning enough to have customers and fans feel that both the system sets and the constraction sets are getting their fair share of the wave. For example: system would have a wave of maybe three locations/buildings and maybe a vehicle set whereas constraction would need to have enough figures to appease constraction fans and not leave any characters out (you can’t be splitting up the Toa between the two waves of the year, it might work, but I wouldn’t want that). Unfortunately, I don’t believe LEGO is ready to invest as much in Bionicle as they have in Star Wars and for this reason I don’t think LEGO could handle Bionicle this way. However, I would want this to work, if possible.

Now, I am open to Bionicle being a purely system theme. Though I don’t think the characters will be represented as well in system, however LEGO could possibly develop a way to make it work. The difficulty will come with the minifigure design and the price limits.The world of Bionicle could come to life in great detail with system, however, I would worry like Garnira that to keep the sets affordable we might end up with some pretty tacky designs. The trouble with minifigures would come when making them resemble bio-mechanical characters yet still keeping the minifigure style (or at least the LEGO droid style). The last thing we want is for Bionicle to try to establish itself as a system theme, but be considered unLEGO like and loose profits because of that. On this same point any visual media (TV show,graphic novel etc.) that comes for Bionicle G3 I would hope would not be a direct minifigure to picture representation as I would find it hard to digest a minifigure looking Toa.

All in all I like Bionicle, because of the story. The sets, though not absolutely necessary for me to enjoy Bionicle, have and would add to that enjoyment.

These are just a few of my thoughts and to be honest I forgot my direction and pretty much everything else at the end there.
If you’ve read this, thanks for your time, sorry about the length.

TL;DR-Presenting my meandering mind. I am your guide Pseudonym.

I actually don’t know if I could summarize this if I wanted to.

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It would work great as system as long as they don’t make EVERY SET A VEHICLE, mostly buildings and landscapes. Vehicles would be like creatures and boats and some carts and such, but no stupid motorcycles and quad bikes and sci-fi tanks.

Fair point indeed.

When splitting things into such a basic aspect such as ‘no’ or ‘yes’ the polls work. However, with the second poll you are splitting things into three categories and two of them are ‘yes’ - one of which with a condition clause that you had to vote a certain way on the previous poll.

In essence, the second poll is effectively useless and its results cannot really be trusted because of the basic principle of three options.

When presented with three options there is normally ‘yes’, ‘maybe’ and ‘no’. Instead what you’ve done here is provide two ‘yes’ options and one ‘no’ option. One of these being an utterly pointless ‘yes’ option given we see who voted for what on the first poll and this could have been easily done on the second poll.

Its basically automatically bias towards yes for the second question. Guess someone really wants to promote the idea that Bionicle should be like Chima… despite Chima’s CCBS line never selling as well resulting in its lack of release in certain areas and cancellation before the line ended and Star Wars which is seemingly having its constraction theme ended in 2017 given comments about a lack of a CCBS theme in 2017.

Nope, the second poll indicates if someone wants constraction with system (which could indicated if they want the system theme if it had specifically the constraction part as well, which further evaluates our opinions regarding this situation as oppose to the yes and no thing which as its clearly been shown here by most is not that straight forward):

Why not use both, like any versitile MOCist.

By having the second poll show who voted for what you could have simply have it be yes or no. The inclusion of the ‘Yes, I’m okay with the compromise’ is unnecessary and effectively botched the entire second poll.

no visible voters
Without showing who voted for what, the second poll can also have liars, people who voted for the middle option without saying ‘no’ in the previous poll.

This first poll shows who voted for what;

The second poll doesnt show who voted for what, likely because of the additional third option (which was added unnecessarily and caused the problem in the first place)

#Accuracy;
Its also less accurate because we see people voting for the first poll currently 85 voters while the second poll currently has 78 - and we have no idea who voted for what so it effectively reduces the accuracy of the second poll.

#Example of how it should have been;
The following would have worked better for the second poll;

“what if the line compromised by having a core line of System
Sets but with Constraction Action Figures (like Star Wars or Chima)?”

  • Yes / I would prefer this
  • No / I would’nt prefer this

#Reasons why this version would work better;
Then we could have seen who voted for what and it would be easier to decipher and discuss for TTV and for fans. It could also be used to balance the polls given the number of voters, as voters who didnt vote on the second poll could then be removed from the overall tally of the first poll in order to get a better comparison.

We could also check if anyone incorrectly picked the middle option in the second poll along with the option to actually see which members would be happy with Bionicle returning in any form VS those who simply would only want a CCBS return.

Effectively TTV shot themselves in the foot when creating the second part of the poll this way. It was an easy mistake to make adding the middle question on the second poll and i guess they didnt figure out that it showed individual members till after so its excuseable, but it could have been a lot more easy and productive for them to discuss more accurate data.

This is more designed as a advisory post to future polls, the error has been made at this stage and the episode will likely be based off these aspects which are not as accurate as they could have been. Hopefully these aspects will be rectified in future versions of polls for TTV’s sake as it’ll enable them to get a better analysis of what the fans want, which could help with making videos (e.g. if people wanted a primarily system return they could do a video on the previous system entries of Bionicle such as the Lava Chamber Gate)

Did you read my previous comment at all?

I know the intention of the second poll, its just the layout means;

  • Its prone to innacuracies and liars
  • It cannot be easily discussed
  • Its difficult to determine who didnt vote in the second poll and thus difficult to balance the votes

I’ve posted a more thorough explanation again on why it doesnt work above, take time and read through it.

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Thats their problem for not voting on the second questionair, not mine.

I think you need to take a chill pill Scarilian, its just a simple Q&A poll, which will become irrelevant after Kahi and the others use it for the next podcast since they will stop using it for their discussion topic (since they will talk about it on the podcast and move on the something else). Plus as you can see its barely a concensus of any kind since its less than 100 persons voting on it.

You are waaaaaaaaaaaay overthinking this which is not the main relevant topic of why this discussion and poll were made for. I would really like to hear your opinion about Bionicle being a system theme than you talking about if the poll is fair or not, which is going off in a tangent. It will be more useful for them and us if we get that detailed from you (which you are an expert of doing), than the previously mentioned thing.

(Its perfectly fine for what Kahi wants to use. If you dont like it, make your own, just like it always has been an option for you).

What. People can lie about their opinions on a poll on the internet. I was not expecting this at all. This is not something that I completely have to assume will be part of any poll. In the future, I will solve this by flying out and contacting each member personally and have them take a lie detector test in order to validate that they are not lying on the internet.

This is true, as evidenced by the fact that we have had only 59 posts in the last 21 hours and they’re all completely empty with no words or discussion between going on in them. What an odd glitch.

Oh no. If only there was some sort of complex system to determine how many votes were given to each option by perhaps using the total number of votes and then using the percentage of each vote to determine a rough number of how many people voted for each option. If the legends are true, there might be some way to discern this information. Possibly by the use of the ancient art of “basic math”.

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God, I hated those.
Ussanui and the Boxor were kinda just there. The Exo-Toa was pretty ok since it was rather an exosuit/actual character than a vehicle. Lesovikk’s Sea Sled (or however it was called), that trap thing that came with Karzahni and Toa Ignika’s board also were pretty boring.
The '08 battle vehicles were for me personally just expensive and useless, and the '09 battle vehicles I didn’t even buy (although I regret it at least to some extend now, since they include the most sets which I’m lacking from the entire G1 - I regret it as a collector, mind you, not because I like them)

I have to admit, though, that I never really liked any vehicles aside from maybe space ships when I was younger anyway. This probably also is why I currently deem Elves and Minecraft the best Lego themes in theory - they focus on world building and on structures, not on vehicles.

Unfortunately it can’t be denied that most kids love the vehicles but find everything else totally boring…

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