The most common Toa torso in the Matoran Universe

Plot twist: the real question is where this topic is supposed to go.

As most of you will know, it was confirmed by Greg that ‘the rest of the Toa Hagah (at least those belonging to Norik’s team) have a Metru-styled torso’. Taking this for granted I thought it was an interesting question to see what this means for the distribution of Toa torso’s in the Matoran Universe. In particular: which torso was the most common when we take this into account? Before I try to answer this question I would like to mention that this is just hypothethical and to enjoy a train of thought. I know there are other reasons we got the torso’s we got (such as the available parts and set designs). Leaving this aside, here’s what I came up with.

First let’s assume that the confirmation provided by Greg is indeed only intended for Teridax’ team of Toa Hagah (i.e. Norik’s team). The first question is how that team came into existence. According to the wikia, its members had been active for quite some time in other Toa Teams and were selected from various areas of the Matoran Universe based on their individual accomplishments. Basically they were some of the best of the best the Matoran Universe had to offer at the time. So far so good. Now comes the important question: what are the odds that the chosen six Toa that ended up in this team…

  • Originated from six different Toa teams all accross the Matoran Universe
  • Were the best of the best
  • And all had the same Metru-styled torso?

I’d argue that the only way in which this is possible is if there were a lot of Toa with the Metru-styled torso. Now I’ll admit right of the bat that it is statistically possible that it was pure coincidence but at the same time it is much more likely that the above conditions were met because there was a very large pool of Toa with the Metru-styled torso to begin with. A large pool of Metru-styled Toa accross the universe would make it more likely that the chosen Toa would be Metru-styled. And similarly a large pool of Metru-styled Toa would make it more likely that some of them were very good and thus got selected.

Of course, we don’t know about the other Toa Hagah teams for sure (assuming the quote was only meant for Norik’s team). Hence it remains perfectly possible that this conclusion is false but based on what we do know I’d argue that it is likely that the Metru-styled torso was (at least at the time of the beginning of the Toa Hagah) the most common. Another indication towards this conclusion is Toa Lhikan who also had a Metru-styled torso, despite never meeting the Toa Hagah. Consequently if we assume this theory to be true, then a randomly selected Toa active at that time most likely has a Metru-styled torso.

EDIT: if we assume the Toa Hagah didn’t come into existence by an exception like Energized Protodermis or the Red Star but rather in the same way the Toa Metru did, this makes it even more likely that the Metru-styled torso was dominant at some point in time. After all, when a Matoran transforms into a Toa, his or her appereance is based on what he or she thinks a Toa looks like (assuming it involves a Toa Stone). And the more Toa with a Metru-styled body, the more likely the images and results correspond.

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Yeah, that checks out.

My question now is how? We know it can’t be the Great-Being-designed standard, because Toa take their shape based on what they think Toa look like, not from any internal design specifications. Also, there are known Toa who don’t look like that.

So that changes the question to “why did so many Toa have that image of a Toa?”

I’m thinking that at least one of the original Toa had that body shape, and that that Toa, or one of their direct “descendants”, became very well-known, causing their image to better known than other Toa.

Even if the Toa Hagah (and Lhikan) weren’t directly inspired by this hypothetical famous Toa, they would have been inspired by someone who was.

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Considering the Hagah all honored past heroes with their masks, it’s not a stretch to suggest that these heroes could’ve been the inspiration behind each of the Hagah. Which slightly concerns me that there’s a team of Bomonga style Toa out there
Jokes aside, as you said there had to be a Toa who inspired at least one Matoran so the Metru body style could become so prevalent. The problem is we only have a few Toa from the early days to check this against and all of them aren’t Metru builds.

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  1. I don’t think there is a most normal – it’s like saying what style of clothing is most normal. It depends on where you live.29

ok… This has been a controversial issue for more than 15 years.

Greg said he doesn’t think there’s a “normal” (maybe the same meaning as standard, default).

This is my opinion.
I think the number of body types that are most common has changed depending on MU’s time.

At least in the early days of the universe, among the toa we know, Nikila is the only one similar to Metru Body…It looks like a mixture of Inika and metru body, but anyway…

There are about 40 Toa surviving now, and only the Hagah team is definitely Metru Body among the Toa we know.

seven toa are Mata bodies(If Helryx is treated as Mata body, it’s probably eight.), and six are Inika bodies.
And there’s one whose origin is unknown, krakua.
However, it can be seen that such body type existed at least in ancient times.

We don’t know what kind of body the five Toa are yet. I hope it’ll be decided quickly.

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To be fair non traditional proportions are not unheard of, even if the other major examples of that were either created that way(Pohatu and Onua) or were given that form under unusual circumstances(Matoro Mahri). So the idea of there being some Toa walking around with big meaty paws is pretty believable in my opinon.

Back to the main point of discussion; if we take Dume having saved Lhikan(which occurred 17,500 years ago in universe) and having a hand in Lhikans becoming a Toa into account, it would be reasonable in my mind to assume Dume sported a Metru build, and given he was a Toa for thousands of years and was later specifically appointed as the Turaga of Metru-Nui, I think its likely that many Matoran actually derived their eventual Toa forms from their encounters with Dume. Or at least that’s my train of thought.

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Limb proportion has stayed very consistent between all toa with the exception of Bomonga and Krakua. Bomonga with his hulk hands and Krakua with his equally long upper leg as lower legs.

All other Toa have shorter upper arms and legs. Except for with the above exceptions and even so Bomonga’s upper limb proportions are still the same as all other Toa.

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This makes sense.

Dume being an extremely important Toa explains a lot. It explains why he was put in charge of Metru Nui, and it also explains how he recognized some of the Toa Mangai despite not asking for them specifically.

If Dume was a “Metru build” in-story, it would make sense that many Toa look like him.

It’s also possible that Bomonga had unique proportions as a Matoran, and the Toa that inspired his transformation still had standard proportions (or at least more standard). I don’t think the transformation necessarily makes the new Toa looks like a 1:1 copy of their inspiration, especially if the Matoran’s image of a Toa comes from multiple sources.

EDIT: I had to try it:

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Obviously the most common type is Hoseryx torsos.

Could be that even though Bomonga was inspired by a regular Metru Toa, he also envisioned earth Toa as being bulkier.

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That is indeed the question. If we pressume that the Toa Hagah were transformed in the same way the Toa Metru were (rather than like for example by the Red Star) this would increase the likeliness of the Metru-styled torso being dominant even further.

Looking back at where it all started it could be that the Metru-styled torso was introduced by yet another exception to the rule of ‘the image a matoran has of what a Toa should look like’. For example by another transformation by Energized Protodermis or the Red Star.

Regardless because the Toa Hagah and their origins go so far back I’d say it was quite likely the Metru-styled torso was the most common at some point in time.

That said, anyone who wants to build Toa Lhikan’s team of 300 Metru-styled Toa during the Toa / Dark Hunter war? :stuck_out_tongue:

So would that mean Nidhiki is a Metru build, as he was recognised by Dume?

Well all 6 Hagah came from a team of 6 Metru builds, meaning there was at one point 36 Metru builds from those teams alone.

A team doesn’t have to be six Toa, or from the same place. There’s no reason to assume Kualus’ team had five other Metru builds; maybe he joined a team of two Inika builds and a Mata build.

Not necessarily. I wasn’t trying to imply that Nidhiki was inspired by Dume (though it is certainly possible, I suppose).

My train of thought is that, because Dume was an important Toa (according to my theory), and later an important and influential Turaga, he is knowledgeable about all of the Toa, even if he has never met them directly. This would also be helped by the fact that the Toa were once an actual organization, rather than independent teams scattered across the universe.

Why do you assume that six of their teams were made up of Toa with the same body shape?

That is true but I was referring to when they were transformed into Toa. Now this might not be true for all Toa, the one example we’ve seen showed 6 Toa being created at the same time. This is due to the Metru Nui Suva, though we don’t know if others have this limit of 6. Along with this, 6 is the amount it takes to form a Toa Seal, which is a pretty good motivator to make groups of 6. Finally Toa Kaita, which while they can be made of 2 members, are stronger with 3.

Now of course the major problem is we have no idea about how Toa are created outside of Metru and Mata Nui. So I could be 100% wrong with my logic.

Even if all six members of each of the teams were transformed together, there’s still no guarantee that they would all look the same. They could easily have all had different visions of what a Toa looks like.

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Oh yeah whoops that’s right, my bad. Keep thinking of the main story Toa Teams but yeah that basically means Toa could like like any blend of styles or unique builds depending on who they’ve seen.

I don’t know what this means. Kaita is unconditionally a fusion of three
If you’re talking about prototype, it’s not Kaita, it’s unnatural fusion.

… lesovikk and Nikila were on the same team.
There is no guarantee that the previous members of teri’s Hagah team were unconditionally six and the body was the same.

Also, considering rebuilding, MU residents may be able to change their armor (here, referring to the entire exoskeleton).

or Teri might have been the one who argued that ‘metru is standard’
At one time, there were about 3,000 Toa, so Teri may have selected only the metru body type as his hagah team.

and there is a possibility that it is rare for six martorans to become toa together.

“4. In the Dark Hunters guide, it states that Prototype (the Dark Hunter) was made by using the Spear of Fusion while two Toa were merging their forms. Can two Toa combine to form a more powerful being, like a Toa Kaita?
4b. If they cannot, was one of the Toa using the Mask of Fusion you canonized a while ago? Here is what the power is listed as this on BS01: Forces a temporary fusion with another being.
4) Possible, though we have never shown it in story”
Official Greg Dialogue | Page 211

Remembered reading this awhile ago, never had the chance to bring it up.

Good point, Teridax does seem like the kind of guy to want a bigger team compared to the other Makuta. We also know Krakua was transformed by himself so that could also be a possibility.

hey wait a minute
Are we sure that Mata builds are widespread?
Like, couldn’t Artakha just have custom built the Mata?

Well, any Av-Matoran who met the Toa Mata in Karda Nui would’ve likely become a Mata build if they became Toa. But none of them became Toa.

That might mean Toa Tanma in the Kingdom was a Mata Build.

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Yes probably
But I meant other than that