Yo, I just finished reading (as of me starting this reply) all 169 comments currently in the topic. I gtg for the night but I’m just going to post some final thoughts for the day.
(Assuming option 1 is picked) I think people should be allowed to used whatever 3D printed masks they wanted in the MoC contest. Could result in reasonable headcanons for what non Hagah (normal) versions of the masks look like, for those of us who care. Then the art contest could hold hard to canon and make the masks look like ancient hero Kanohi. We already have precedent, both the Helryx and Artahka mocs wore non canon (in Helryx’case, to her final artwork) masks. I see no reason the Hagah mocs couldn’t either. Everybody wins, or at the very least the folks who want a canon compliant art drawing win. Us nerds who want to know what a mask of rahi control looks like might win, depending on the winning MoC.
Here are some cool Metru builds. Tokah and Mahuna in particular have interesting builds, though the rest of them all show that (in my mind) that even with wildly different feet and limb pieces, these dudes are still recognizable as a Metru builds. If you were to give the trademark Hagah shield and spear to Tokah for example, I would easily be able to see him as Bomonga. He’d an earth Toa with the right torso and the right weapons. Works for me. [Edit: ALSO!!! I don’t know who made these Mocs, I would’ve credited them otherwise. If anyone knows, I’d appreciate a reply. Thanks, and sorry for not crediting the creator, it’s been over a year since I download that image, I can’t remember from when or where]
Proportions wouldn’t be an issue if you ban custom torsos as then you are given a frame you must adhere to. Also there is always a guy who is going to try and bend the rules but kf they do they’ll most likely get voted out anyway becuse they stray to far from the common consensus.
Do you have any idea how much proportions play into what a moc looks like? If you build a moc with the same proportions as a metru moc, it’ll look a lot like a metru build.
You can use a Metru torso, but what about the people that want to give the hagah a custom torso so it can bend its waist? Or add a special armor they really like? If you’re worried about the custom builders, restrict the proportions, don’t restrict the pieces
I’ll say in advance that I won’t go into the same depth here that I do in the other topic, but I’ll quickly rebuff your points, Dag.
The books have never been a source of debate. No point in even mentioning them.
Again, I thoroughly dissect this discussion in the other topic (which it seems you haven’t had a chance to review yet, so please take a moment to consider the point i’m trying to make there), but in sum, first review this quote.
First of all, notice the date. This quote was published in 2009, four years after the original quote was published. In 2008, Greg had already responded to a similar question saying “I really don’t remember. The Hagah storyline was three years ago, and I am wrapped up in 2010 right now.”
The history of the Hagah masks is a complicated affair, but it takes several leaps of logic to establish, and if I were Greg, I wouldn’t have remembered the details myself.
Now, notice that the OP only posts the bit about Norik not having a mask in its usual shape. If I were Greg, and was only reminded about the “rule”, and not reminded that Iruini was already an exception to this rule, I’d definitely say that there are no exceptions.
Taking the logic of the quote on its own terms, Iruini physically cannot have a mask that matches its power because he is, in fact, one of the “other Toa Hagah.” But we know that this isn’t true, and that Iruini is an exception. As such, it’s worth determining if there are more clarifications.
To copy and paste what I said in the other topic, I’ll settle with whatever wins the competition. The point of this post is to see if people would be unlimited by this particular constraint and free to post (and vote for) whatever they want, regardless of this talking point. Unless you have a personal vendetta against fan-made Masks of Emulation, I’m not sure why asking Greg for clarification on this is a problem.
If the TTV cast must compromise, then I say restrict the proportions of the moc. Measure out how many units the torso is (how tall, how thick, how wide). Then measure out how many units the upper thigh is, then the lower leg, upper arm, lower arm. Restrict those proportions and let the people customize what they want. You’ll find the custom Moc entries resembling the standard metru build.
Frankly I still would rather have the TTV cast pick one of the two extremes: either complete restriction or complete freedom, but if you have to compromise, then there’s my suggestion
You’re ignoring my point. Your logic as to why we shouldn’t require metru torsos is that people can just build around it to make something that isn’t recognizably a metru build. What I am saying is that people can do that even more easily with full custom builds.
You say we should just restrict builds to using metru proportions. In that case, we are, as you said,
If we’re going to have to define what is proportional to a metru build either way, why not also enforce what literally makes a metru build a metru build. By your logic, this is essentially a metru build.
Restricting the pieces and build in this case helps more as it keeps main astethics and proportions similar to the already established hagah. HAVING CUSTOM TORSOS OR FREE RANGE will only lead to way too clashing models and ruin cohesion. Yes custom torso can follow the same porportions but why should people do that when they can do whatever, that’s why you should limit parts usage and builds so that people need to adhere to a certain frame of reference.
People chose wombat combat’s artakha over WholesomeGadunka’s artakha. I think it’s safe to say people will choose what they want as “canon friendly” for a hagah contest, even in the face of extreme customized builds that in my opinion looks way better
Sure, and given what we have, it’s a reasonable solution to solve the contradiction. The problem is that, as you say, it’s an interpretation. But there’s nothing in the quote to infer that Greg was taking Iruini into account when he said this.
As such, it’s worth clarifying with Greg, wouldn’t you say?
All right, imma repost what I said in the old topic, my ideal ruleset. Somewhat modified, as I’ve given more thought to a lot of things.
Custom torsos are allowed. If one wins, it canonically becomes a variation of the metru build, no different from the Rahkshi of heat vision.
3d weapons and masks are allowed. Any 3d masks would just be an unknown mask power. For example, they could be the shape of a mask of fire. Only exception: pouks cannot wear the mask of emulation.
Placeholder shield, or no shield, is allowed. Art must draw the rhotuka launching shield piece, however. This means you don’t have to paint pieces, or obtain a fairly rare piece.
Art contest for all four together (norik and iruini optional but encouraged). this gives us a team shot. I would also say each of the four should be prominently displayed, enough that you can crop out a picture for the individual Toa for their pages.
Art CANNOT alter the mask shape of the winning mocs, but is allowed to alter mettalic colours. this is to allow for mettalic armour distribution, while also giving moccists something to contribute. So if the winning bomonga is silver and has a kaukau, the art must have a kaukau, but can make the armour gold, gunmetal, even mettalic purple.
My point is you’re taking away other people’s entry and chance to participate and show off what they want because of some arbitrary rule of metru torsos, one that might actually be better than a moc that uses those pieces