BIONICLE G1 Canon Contests Discussion & Questions

Ok, I haven’t read all those last 200+ messages, so no idea if it has been brought up, but - has anyone yet considered that anything more complex than a set Metru build will look very different from the existing two Hagah?

I’m seeing a lot of Metru build Hagah with balljoint shoulders and addons to make the hips fit in better and complex armoring etc. - and that all looks better than the original set Metru build, I’m not denying that. However, it also looks noticeably different if you place them side by side with the sets of Norik and Iruini, I’d say.

So what’s really the goal here? Something that works with Norik and Iruini, or something that looks good? At the point where it has to look like Norik and Iruini I still do not see why we need a Hagah contest at all. Metru builds at the core are still clone sets.

If the goal isn’t to make the other Hagah fit in perfectly with Norik and Iruini, then there’s not really any reason to define a Metru build as anything other than something with specific proportions, i.e. allow custom torsos and limbs.

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@Willess12 I believe that he more options people have, the less they will argue in the comments about more minor details. Plus with enough variants there can be implemented the system with 3 preferences, just like with normal contest polls.
@Racie02 That is a cool idea, but I believe the Cast needs the exact rule formulation, in order to implement it. Also, I think that when someone votes, he wants to know exactly what rule he is voting for.
@TheJerminator There are much: do people want to canonize new mask powers? What metallic colors for Hagah armor should be? Should it be restricted at all? What about Hagah’s art and MOC portions going together or separate? ALL of the rules could’ve been settled by the Cast, but, as far as I know, they are really interested in community’s opinion.

Why can’t we go straight to the art portion with the Hagah? Draw the whole team with the unified look. What exactly are the advantages of the MOCs here?

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Because doing a MOCing portion is going to allow more people to enter the contest. In case you haven’t noticed, there are far more contest submissions in the MOCing portion of the contest than there are in the artwork portion.

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Accessibility matters, and a lot more people would be excluded from entering by an art contest. If you want your moc to be drawn, you would have to convince someone to draw your design over their own and hope they make the right creative decisions. Drawing the whole team, if required, would lead to the conundrum of picking between your favorite Kualus and Gaaki.

Requiring a metru torso and proportions similar to the Toa Hagah isn’t egregiously restrictive imo, although the question of whether this will be mandatory is clearly still up in the air. Both matter so I don’t think you should have one without the other.


Personally, I don’t see the necessity in having contests for the Toa Hagah at all, especially since it comes off as another case of unnecessarily confirming nitty gritty details. Regardless, I can’t see the more successful entries straying that far from the design of Norik and Iruini, such as giving Pouks anything other than metru brown. I think you’re shooting yourself in the foot if you do otherwise, but that’s probably going to be shown through the votes.

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I think only requiring the torso piece to be used (along with reasonable proportions) is a healthy balance between the two. Even in the story they all come from different teams, which can explain the variations.

Also, if we are going to just require them to be color-swapped clones of the two Hagah, then there might as well not even be a MOC contest.

Purely out of curiosity, am I supposed to have gotten anything catching up on the last 130+ epistles?

Cuz I didn’t get anything at all other than - “mettur build iz torso, u dumb”, and “custom torso all d way, no u”

This is why I’m enjoying these contests, and this community, less and less. People can’t just enjoy things for what they are - they have to sour them by getting into long, drawn-out, nitty-gritty arguments that go nowhere and accomplish nothing. We should be uniting under the fact that we’re getting to add to the dead canon, not creating incredibly divisive scenarios where literally no one is willing to compromise or admit that they’re wrong.

Just give it a break, you guys. I’ve stated this before, but why does everything need to be so meticulously spelled out? Why can’t we just enjoy being creative and adding to the new canon? It’s not like the two are mutually exclusive. And maybe, just maybe, if people stopped being butthurt about others’ opinions, we might be able to enjoy it.

As far as the issue at hand goes - and this is probably going to be interpreted as a double-standard from what I just said - I think custom torsos should be allowed, but people should enter with the expectation that a lot - a lot - of people won’t vote for your entry because of that creative choice.

The contests are for canon purposes, not for the people. That’s why the argument “not everyone has a Metru torso” doesn’t work. And don’t forget about Nikila or Surel.

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I was hoping this conversation would have more or less wrapped up by this morning. I think on this we might all have to agree to disagree.

In the spirit of wrapping up this topic, here’s a poll. That way TTV doesn’t have to wade through the entire chat history to see what we think.

Select all that apply, that way we can see where people agree/disagree.

  • Can use a custom torso build
  • Must have reasonable Toa proportions
  • Must use the Metru gearbox piece
  • Must use additional Metru pieces (gears, cover, etc.)
  • Must follow the build of Norik/Iruini closely
  • Other

0 voters

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Creating new canon will ultimately prove most people wrong to varying degrees. So lengthy debates over stuff ultimately simply mean that everyone already has their headcanon to a degree, which of course they’d want to become the real canon.

At which point I’m again not sure what we gain by canonizing anything. No canon basically means that everyone is right with their headcanon. That’s a win for everyone.
The appeal of getting your creation and your name associated with a franchise you love is strong, I don’t deny it, but is it worth all this debating? Is it worth proving people’s headcanons wrong?

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That’s a given, you are always choosing between the things you like in different entries.

Agree.

I don’t have such faith.

I’m not sure people did the poll correctly. Following the Norik/Iruini build closely implies the use of additional Metru pieces, since I said check all that apply.

Also, what did people mean by “other”? I must have missed some views since that got so many votes.

All of which is true, but you leave out a major counterpoint: the appeal of being able to add to the canon as a community, not just a handful of people being personally associated with it. I think headcanon is a sacrifice many people are willing to make to have a shot at revitalizing Bionicle.

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Or a facsimile which matches the proportions.

Yes, but not as nearly as there could be. And also a complete lack of waist articulation.

Bear in mind the same community which made Metru builds also made some of the most complex models under the sun- heck, even the last contest had the insanely well-crafted Artakha by WholesomeGadunka. It’d be a pain to micromanage, sure, but it’s not unrealistic to offer people the freedom to build in their building.

If it has been, I not only haven’t seen it anywhere, but I’ll wager it isn’t very pretty.

I have a strong suspicion this whole series of debates is but part one on the subject. Once TTV gets a concept of rules out, it’s going to be debated probably twice as much, and by that point there’ll probably be a better picture of certainty.

Speaking only for myself I intend to lay the matter mostly to rest if TTV decides the best course of action is to use the Metru torso piece, which I will gladly admit is the simpler and safer of the options, but the arguments so far in defense of it haven’t really been for simplicity or safety purposes, but in community standards and a canon rule that doesn’t exist.

That’s still quite ridiculous to me.

Uh… No. No? No.

I do not have any headcanon as to hat the Toa Hagah look like, I didn’t have any headcanon for Artakha and Helryx, and I don’t think I’ll have any for the other characters when they show up. The winner of the last contest denied his headcanon to go with a canonically accurate entry. You can’t claim these are all based around headcanon, no; these are all people trying to have the best and most accurte contest possible.

Some are arguing for more creative freedom while others are arguing for a stricter definition, but nobody is arguing with the reason of canonizing one model they saw three years ago. We want this contest to have the best possible outcome, even if we don’t quite agree on how others want it to be handled. That’s why the debates and the bickering and the occasional fisticuffs; nobody’s here with a personal motive.

Then again…

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Custom torso’s are fine, but should strive to fit the metru aesthetic. Hard to regulate, but I doubt the top entries will deviate from it.

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As you said, that would be very difficult to enforce in the rules. If custom torsos are allowed, then its similarity to a Metru build should be determined by the voters.

Anyways, I think everyone has sufficiently stated their opinion, so for now let’s give this topic a rest. Make sure to fill out the poll, select all that apply, and specify “other” if you picked that.

Yeah I don’t think anyone is changing their minds anytime soon. The poll isn’t too bad in concept but I can see how the wording confuses some people.


That’s fair, and I plan to do the same if it goes the other way around :+1:


Canon contests are inherently going to invalidate headcanons, but that’s always been the name of the game :man_shrugging:

I get that these contests are exciting, but figuratively nobody is going to care about the losing entries within a few months of the contest ending.

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I believe poll deserves its own topic, so it doesn’t get buried here. And I am glad it finaly exists. Also I think “reasonable Toa proportions” should be rephrased to “reasonable Toa Metru proportios”, because other Toa have great variety in proportions.

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I haven’t posted on these message boards much, where should I create this topic?

Blue circle in the lower right corner, appears while you are on a certain page, for example “new” in the menu, if you are asking about that. If talking about category, then it is Lego and Bionicle ones.

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