Just got the parts in for Lhikan, and I’m now ready for the tuyet contest
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The cape you’ve added has me thinking.
How would people feel about an option to designate their entries by type of Tuyet? Kind of like the consent system for the Toa Hagah, this would be a way for entrants to designate which version of Tuyet they’d like to cater their entry toward. When we send the winning entry to Greg, we’d specify that it’s for the canon appearance of (blank) version of Tuyet. This wouldn’t result in individual polls, it’d still be for a single winning entry.
As an example:
ENTRY INTENDED TO BE:
-Prime Universe Tuyet
-Dark Mirror Tuyet
-Both
Not something we’ve discussed at length, just tossing the thought out there and see what you all think about it.
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Did Tuyet have a substantially different appearance in Dark Mirror? I don’t think I’d be too interested even if she did–supposing a Dark Mirror Tuyet MOC won, we’d never really know what Prime Universe Tuyet looked like, which… kinda hamstrings a large part of the contest’s purpose, in my opinion.
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That’s the big question, really. The compromise the thought attempts to be for is for those that feel that Tuyet does look different in Dark Mirror than she does normally. In StudentScissors current version, Tuyet bears a cape and dark, spikey armor - I’m certain that’s meant to evoke a particular atmosphere that many wouldn’t readily associate with a Prime Universe Toa.
Again, nothing we’re actively considering, just curious what people think about the concept.
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I think that’s a really, really good idea, if nothing else than to appease the most people and prevent the most conflict.
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I s’pose if the question is just left open, yeah, we may as well have people submit what they think is the most iconic Tuyet version, whether or not Dark Mirror looks different from Prime Universe.
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I don’t like this idea.
To me, Prime Tuyet is far more important than Dark Mirror Tuyet, and the prime universe should be the focus of these contests.
However, that’s not my biggest problem with the idea; even if people disagree with me and would rather see Dark Mirror Tuyet, then whatever, but then that should be known from the start of the contest. It makes no sense to me to not even know what character is being canonized until the contest is over.
Here’s another idea: you said you wouldn’t do a separate contest for each version, but have you considered just doing two art contests? One would have to follow the MOC winner exactly (or at least as exactly as the past art entrants have) and be Prime Tuyet, while the other could take more extreme liberties and be Dark Mirror Tuyet.
The only issue with this is that it would require a separate Mask Contest to ensure that both versions at least have the same mask.
Again, I’m open to the idea of canonizing Dark Mirror Tuyet rather than Prime Tuyet (though I still disagree with it), but it should absolutely be made clear which version the contest is for before it starts.
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That might be the better outcome.
Think about the biggest complaint against these contests: they stifle creativity, by giving only one appearance to a character. But if a black, spiky DMT like Student’s wins, people can make a “good” PT based on the canon model; conversely, if a heroic-looking PT wins, people can moc a dark, spiky DMT based on the canon model.
I wouldn’t mind if a Tuyet with the Nui Stone fragments was allowed under this, too. So basically there’d be three versions (though one would be mutually exclusive from the other two)
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I believe that the characters Takanuva met on his journey through the multiverse were variants. That’s how DC and Marvel are handling things, so why not us?
ALSO
I REALLY LIKE THIS IDEA.
This should be done for Tuyet from Dark Mirror, Toa Macku from The Melding, Toa Tanma from The Kingdom, the Kestora from the core dimension (so they can look different from those in City of Silver pocket dimension), etc.
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Technically, there’s a third tuyet: the dead doppleganger who maybe helped Hydraxon when the pit fell. But having us only have a picture for her would be (and I’m going to use technical lore-analysis language here) dumb.
I’d say I’m of two minds on making the creator specify which one. On one hand, it simplifies the issue on BS01 of “which Tuyet is this a picture of?”. On the other hand…we’ve had this debate, I don’t want to reawaken it, but we have absolutely every reason to believe tuyet looks the same accross universes.
Compromise proposal: specify which tuyet it is at the art portion, and allow for “undefined” to be an option. This basically means you’d be taking the tuyet “set”, and depicting it doing evil dark mirrory things, or prime universy things, similar to how characters with other AU counterparts were used (if that makes sense).
Second compromise proposal: two poll sets, two winners at the art portion: one for Tuyet Prime, one for Mirror Tuyet. This would give us both versions of the art that we may want, while also not making Mirror Tuyet compete against Tuyet Prime. This creates the complication of “how do we make their kanohi match”, but I’m sure there’s a solution.
EDIT: possible solution to proposal two might be do prime art contest first, then dark mirror contest, but even though the results on that long-term will be great in my opinion, there may be pushback.
EDIT 2: I shouldn’t have just skimmed the thread, Jerminator came up with this idea before me, I swear I wasn’t just plagarising.
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Just mandate prime Tuyet then. That’s the one we should be canonizing. Those who want to make a darker evil Tuyet based on the moc/art, can still do so, but this contest should be canonizing the prime Tuyet.
The problem is that we’d be canonizing that there is a difference, which as you pointed out, currently has no canonical basis.
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Personally, I agree. That being the case, for your consideration:
Entered Tuyet is Prime Universe Tuyet by default. Option for entrants to either suggest it for Dark Mirror as well, or only as Prime?
Personally, I feel like these complicate things more than anything else.
At the end of the day, the easiest solution would be to just focus on Prime Universe and leave it there. This is only serving to act as a compromise for those that feel “evil-looking” Tuyet’s may not be befitting of the Prime Universe. That said, this may be a case of trying to cater to a specific outcome before voters have their say, which should be avoided if possible.
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A lot of people feel that prime Tuyet should look dark and villainous; others feel she should look more heroic. I don’t care for villainous Tuyet, but I’d prefer it over only having a villainous appearance for Dark Mirror Tuyet and nothing for prime.
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I agree that I personally want Prime Universe characters primarily, and that the focus in the contests should be there (we didn’t have a contest for mirror Kualus and Bomonga, for example).
I do think, though, that Tuyet is an extraordinary case with few other examples. Her AU counterpart has a bit of an iconic status, which leads to two competing problems:
1: Passing up on an opportunity to depict her in her mirror form feels like a wasted opportunity
2: Passing up on an opportunity to depict her in her prime form feels like a wasted opportunity.
I do think there’s space here for some kinda super artistic art that integrates parts of Prime Tuyet and Mirror Tuyet, but I cannot imagine many people will make something like that.
Again, I am unsure off the top of my head of any other character this is true for (I mean, actually, that’s not true, it’s true of Teridax, but we DID end up getting a visual depiction for his light version). Unless anyone can think of a character who’s contest may call for two different results, Tuyet is an unusual case that will not repeat. It may not hurt to treat her as such.
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This might be the best option. Allow voters to establish that they’re the same, or leave it open that Farm Mirror could be different, but not writing new canon by canonically establish that they’re different.
Edit
Thank you autocorrect.
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This Tuyet wasn’t really super relevant to the story; she likely wouldn’t qualify for these contests on her own.
Besides, unlike other alternate Tuyets, we already know for sure that she looks like Prime Tuyet (otherwise the duplicate plot wouldn’t have worked), so her appearance will be decided with Prime Tuyet’s.
We could, but that would be more of trivia canonization than appearance canonization.
We’d also run into the issue where people vote for the relation to Dark Mirror Tuyet, rather than the appearance itself.
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Like in the Loki series: there are variants who are identical in aspect but slightly differ from one another in something small, those who are a gender-bent version, those who are taller, smaller, wider, thinner, young and old.
The body that Matoro found with Teridax happens to be a variant that’s similar to Tuyet. However, Tuyet from Dark Mirror might probably look SLIGHTLY different since Takanuva doesn’t remember how she looks like thanks to the Matoran Sphere’s mechanism to wipe out any trace of memory from the individual within it. She might look somewhat like a regular Toa but she possess Gunmetal armor on top like a Toa Hagah would, a cape and a reshaped version of the Prime Tuyet’s Mask of Intangibility for the sake of looking evil, imposing, strong, etc.
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The problem with that comparison is that where you can have very different Loki’s that were born different, we do know the point of divergence for Tuyet: when Nidhiki chose to join her side instead of Lhikan. Dark Mirror Tuyet looked the same as Prime Tuyet up until that point, and any difference in her appearance would have to have happened after she defeated Lhikan.
Yes, she could have modified her armour to be more befittering of a “Dark empress”; I just don’t think that’s something the contests should establish.
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I think it would be most prudent to only have a Prime universe Tuyet contest. Most conflict that I am aware of seems to come from those who idolize a dark version of Tuyet. By focusing on the not-evil-looking Tuyet build we would 1) canonize her appearance as she would continuing on in the story (now being freed from her imprisonment of the OoMN) 2) allow for the edge-lord portion of the Bionicle community free reign to add bulky, dark, or spikey armor for a Dark Mirror version to their own imagination’s desire.
This would bring closure to the appearance of the character, while simultaneously allowing for some imaginative freedom for how she would look corrupted by power. And, besides, the argumentative types will always try to find some flaw in anything that occurs, so allowing for this compromise should ease some sanity into the contest.
For my two cents on the weapon debate: while I would like to see her wield a weapon, I don’t think it should be mandated. As we’ve seen with the likes of Kongu, Toa can freely toss away their tools and replace them if they so wish. By this standard alone, it can’t be stated that the only tool we’ve seen her with was the one that she would have currently. And as mentioned previously, her story as it was left off had her escaping captivity, so who’s to say that she even has a weapon right now. She could very well be a blank slate in this manner.
However, if an artist chooses to draw Tuyet with a barbed broadsword, or any other weapon for that matter, I don’t think it should be disregarded as he/she might very well have done a rather soulful and deserving effort to fit an artistic aesthetic. This shouldn’t be ignored and be honored as her current choice of tool.
These are my thoughts; hope I at least encouraged some form of unity.
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eh
I’d like to have it be solely Prime Tuyet, because that’s the whole point of the contest, isn’t it?
I’m still entering though, regardless.
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