Shaka, when the walls fell. There’s a tangent to go on about the nuances of the Tamarian language and how we can apply the lessons learned in that episode to this situation, but I don’t feel it’d quite be appropriate for this thread.
Also I don’t want to write it
Do go watch the episode though, as what I’d be writing would essentially just be the lessons of the episode with accompanying literary context and analysis, and I’m pretty sure everyone in this discussion can understand the lessons of an episode of TNG.
At the start of this argument, I was on your side Votuko. I’ve been a passionate defender of Faber since the beginning, and every time he’s come under fire I’ve jumped to his defense - my contributions to this topic should more than prove that. However, it’s become clear to me as this has unraveled that nothing that they’re asking for here is unreasonable. Some criticism is justified for how this has been handled, even if this is something that can (and hopefully will) easily be fixed, perhaps with that interview with TTV. The lengths you’re going to to split hairs at this point are just ludicrous. All you’re doing at this point is embarrassing yourself.
To clarify, NDAs do not stop you from saying what kind of thing you are working on, nor do they stop you from saying what it is that thing hopes to achieve or do.
People are just fundamentally misunderstanding that we’re talking about two different things here: the business side and the idea side. We want to be informed on the idea side, which comes before and has no bearing on the business side.
For some reason, though, people seem to think we want business details.
And clearly the idea already exists, because Faber is already on to working out the business stuff.
Genuine question: If you’re supporting Faber by default, just by existing as someone who likes BIONICLE, then what’s the difference if you don’t support Faber?
That was the intended meaning behind my comments - I’m glad you agree. (By tailored pitches, I mean he would talk up how said story could be applicable to the company’s product.)
Because being a fan of Bionicle =/= supporting Faber. Just like being a fan of Bionicle =/= supporting TTV, or RSG, or QFMN, or any other project. I can be a fan without supporting Faber. His relevant pitch stats aren’t the size of the Bionicle Fandom, because that’s in essence, immeasurable. The fact of the matter is that I follow his Instagram and am immensely interested in what he’s working on. But my interest is rapidly waning.
Just to really hammer this point home:
I signed an NDA when I started working for my current employer. I am legally bound to not release any information with regard to our clients.
I can still say “I work for blank Communications Consulting Firm doing Web, Social Media, and Business Auditing for both companies and political parties and candidates, while also providing Video editing for both our clients and ourselves and running the recording, editing, and distribution of our podcast.”
NDA =/= radio silence, it means you can’t share proprietary or confidential information without legal repercussions. I can still say what I do on the day to day as long as I don’t release specifics about clients.
This would be a good place to bring things back to the ocean metaphor, actually. We’re stood on the beach, and he’s riding the wave. We have to figure out how to make a surfboard - shaped - like - a - giant - pencil from what we have on the beach, and well…
Thank you for explaining. You hadn’t mentioned being an Instagram follower as being what you meant by “supporting” before so I was confused what it was you are offering Faber.
Think I’ll skip the hammering, because as you say, we really have been here before and my answers are earlier in the thread. I’ll call it a day before someone posts the dodgy professor/student analogy a third time.
But like hear me out… what if we waited until he had something like that he can disclose that would satisfy people and potentially not backfire on him.
Pakari (and Meso, actually) mentioned this earlier but the silence is already backfiring on him. All waiting does is postpone the inevitable disappointment of anyone who doesn’t get what they want out of Faber’s project, not negate it. Rip the band-aid off earlier = less pain down the line.
Right now people are wondering if there even is a project. Any clarity Faber can shed will ultimately result in him cementing his base and being able to attract people who are specifically interested in what he’s doing. Right now the interest is in what he might be doing, and therefore the longer we wait to figure out, the more people get on the Wave, the more potentially angry/disappointed people there are when he finally tells us where the Wave is going.
He can disclose “I want to make a multimedia IP, inspired by Bionicle”, right now, and most of the people kicking up a fuss would shut up and go home. There’s no NDA that’s stopping him from doing that. As has been demonstrated several times in this thread, NDAs aren’t a corporation-induced ball-gag. Would some people be disappointed? Undoubtedly. But it’ll clear the air and keep things from getting any worse.
Took way to long for me to write this, so new post.
I’m still not sure we’re on the same page here, though.
To give an example of a “tailored pitch,” I’ll use an example I know well: an artist portfolio.
If I wanted to work as a concept artist for a certain studio, I would research that studio. If they typically do things in a stylized, cartoony kind of way, it would be harmful to me to submit a portfolio (my pitch) filled with realistic portraits or landscapes. I would want to tailor my work to that studio. That doesn’t mean I have to change the subject matter of my work, just how it’s presented.
It’s the same with a product pitch. Like Kini said, you don’t present a movie script to a TV show producer. You also don’t present a vague, “maybe it could be this” idea to every possible form of media company because they will immediately escort you out of their office because you don’t know what it is you’re making.
It’s just not how business works. You decide what form it’s going to take, then tailor that to specific companies in that field. You don’t tailor the general idea to multiple different forms of media.
Yep, exactly this. It would just be way too late at that point. Like, obviously if he comes out with something concrete to show, we’ll know what it is he’s doing. But he will lose a lot of people (and therefore, support) by not disclosing that now (and he easily can), and if that thing winds up not even being what the people who stuck around wanted, they will leave too and bring negative attention to the finished product.
We made Biocraft, yeah? We said right off the bat it was gonna be Minecraft Bionicle Year 1.
What if we hadn’t?
What if we’d just said “Hey, we’re making a movie.” with no information. Is it Bionicle related? Is it live action? Animated?
All of these questions are ultimately not necessary to get hyped for “TTV’s making a movie” but if we had gone that route and spent nearly 8 years talking about working on it, before finally coming out with Biocraft as a machinima made in minecraft I don’t think i’m out in the woods thinking that people would be (rightly) pissed.
This analogy obviously isn’t 1-1 because Faber’s only been working for 2 years, but whatever growing pains will happen when the inevitable disappointment of individuals not getting what they wanted happens, it’ll be so much worse the longer it takes to get there
I think we would be in the same situation wether he revealed it or not people who feel he didn’t reach their arbritary expectations would rally their torches and pitchforks because they are disappointed by the outcome.
Right now people feel stringed along because they don’t know what the project is about but lets say he does reveal his intentions do you really think people wont just claim he stringed them along anyway because again it didn’t reach their expectations.
The only difference between saying it now, and saying it later, is that those angry, entitled people, who will hopefully disperse after they’ve gotten their manchild rage out of their system, will feel like they had significantly less of their time wasted.
Once they’re gone, we’re just left with the people who actually care about the project being produced. There are less of them, sure, but they’re passionate about what’s being actually made, not just the preconceived fantasy they have in their heads. Isn’t that a good thing?
And, as a side-effect, it will also draw in more people who like that specific idea.
Like, honestly, if Faber is actually making a new Bionicle toy-line or something like that, I’m personally not that interested. I’ve long been out of the market for buying toys. But if it’s like, a spiritual successor, collaborative story-telling initiative that uses a similar aesthetic and themes, that would be really awesome, and even people who don’t know about Bionicle might discover it and support it.
I’m not saying it will be either of those things, but clarifying the idea:
Lets say this what if he reveals his intetions the majority is onboard with it then when whatever he is doing actually comes out its different due to compromises and other hick ups along the way, if so did he string us along? Would fans still be positive or will they claim Faber broke a promise?
Edit: Lets say he said he wanted to make a G3 but it ended up just a spirutal succesor because he couldn’t land certain key pitches. Is it his fault for breaking a promise?