Earth and Stone--Which to replace?

Before I begin, this isn’t really a thread about elements. It’s about characters, worldbuilding, and action scenes.

I’ve been cooking various ideas for my own take on Bionicle, and one of the things I sought to revise was the element system. I wanted to refine it into a somewhat hard magic system and to refine the list of elements into something more intuitive. The current list, following some helpful feedback from another thread, looks like this:

Fire, Water, Earth, Ice, Air, Lightning, Flora, Kinesis, Iron, Ash, Poison, Light

You may notice that Stone is gone, and this isn’t about my opinion on these elements so much as my goal of making it clear what each element is. We’ve been debating whether Earth and Stone should be separate for almost 20 years, and I think that’s enough reason to merge them because that tells me that the difference isn’t intuitive enough.

This, however, creates a problem, as the Toa Mata, who return as this story’s protagonists, cannot have 2 Toa of Earth because of how they’re integrated into this world. In short, they’re essentially gods or culture heroes, and the Matoran believe they are the immortal spirits of the natural world. Each element thus gets only one Toa. (Also, it’d be boring to have 2 Earthbenders on the team.)

EDIT: At another poster’s recommendation, I am amending this post and including a poll. There are now a handful of options; Kinesis was formerly on the table for replacing Stone, but the decision now comes down to the following options:

  • Pohatu now becomes the Toa of Iron, and Po-Koro becomes the village of Iron with an economy more based around metalworking than stonemasonry. The Po-Wahi desert could now be red or blue from iron or copper deposits in the sand.
  • Onua now becomes the Toa of Iron, as the Onu-Matoran work with machines and mine for ores.
  • Onua becomes the Toa of Flora (Plantlife under a new name), and Onu-Wahi is now built within the roots of great trees that reach for miles beneath the ground. Just as the plants bore into the earth for sustenance, so too do the Onu-Matoran.

I want to preserve as much of Onua and Pohatu’s fighting styles as possible, as well as the lifestyles of their respective villagers. Here’s a poll for you to gauge what you think is the best option: http://www.strawpoll.me/21134012

There’s probably more things I haven’t thought of, but that’s kind of why I’m turning to you. I’ve made a decision, and now I need to work out how best to keep it from interfering with the fidelity to my source material. I want it to feel like a new story that builds on the old rather than just erasing it.

So, thoughts? Which option sounds better to you, and what other ramifications would each one have?

EDIT: At another user’s recommendation, here’s most of the important parts of the lore, just so you understand some of my machinations and what I’ve already laid out. Not all of this is relevant to the discussion, and you can probably afford to skip it, but it may help get us on the same page.

  • The Toa are the 3rd run in a hierarchy of gods. They represent the forces of nature and dictate daily life and commerce. Who are the 6 Toa? Well, different Matoran will tell you different things. It’s a bit like Mesopotamian religion, wherein every city-state chose a different supreme deity–Babylon, for example, favored Marduk, but its rivals did not. The Toa are culture heroes and purported ancestors of the current 12 Matoran ethnic groups, but the Toa Mata we know and love return to the world of the living for the main story…except they know nothing of their past, and they’re not quite like the legends told that they would be.
  • Above the Toa are the Great Beings: Artakha, the god of life and creation; Karzahni, the god of death and tormentor of wicked souls; Akamai, the god of war; Wairuha, the god of wisdom and knowledge; and Papu and Rangi, whose functions I still have to work out. At the top is Mata Nui, who currently slumbers. Banished into the void is the Makuta, Mata Nui’s 7th son who betrayed his father and was banished by the Toa long ago.
  • Matoran geopolitics draw on historical city-states, like those of Greece and Mesopotamia. The story takes place in the midst of a period of peace brought about by the incumbent Turaga, all of whom are renowned war heroes. There are regional disputes, but recently, the Turaga have made an effort to decide these over games of Koli rather than military conflicts.
  • Love is canon, as are children. Some named characters are actually related: Jala, for example, is Vakama’s grandson, and Nuparu is Onepu’s nephew. (Side note: because Matoran aren’t sexually dimorphic, they have no concept of sexual orientation and have no word for “gay.”)
  • Matoran don’t live for thousands of years. They last a couple centuries at most, and that takes a lot of luck.
  • Matoran are very invested in their religion, and they believe that the ultimate goal of existence is to bring the return of Mata Nui so the Makuta can finally be destroyed.
  • All elements are divided based on what kind of mana they have. Mana manifests in matter and energy, and it comes in different types. This is how Matoran explain the difference between elements beyond their obvious properties. Ice is not Water because it has different mana. Toa are innately linked to certain mana and can control anything with that mana as though it were part of their own bodies.
  • Nobody knows what Protodermis is or how to use it. Matoran and Rahi bodies are made from it, and there are some giant Protodermis structures in Okoto-Nui, but its origins are unknown and generally ascribed to Mata Nui himself. What the structures are for and how they got there is still a mystery.
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Onu Koro is going to be Le-Koro 2.0

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I think that Onua should be made into the toa of flora, and that Pohatu should keep his element, because I think that earth and plantlife are already somewhat related (as you said). I also like you’re idea for the new Flora region.

Also, I’m curious: have you thought about the colors of each of the toa/elements?

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I think that having stone replaced with kinesis is the better option. The entire thing with the po-matoran being all athletic is kinda odd, since stone isn’t the first ting I think of when I hear athletic. Also, stone feels more like a subset of earth than the other way around. I mean, doesn’t earth include rock? Rock and stone are wayyy too close. Furthermore, turning onu-matoran into matoran of flora would be bad since that would just create a new problem with flora, plantlife, and air.

Another idea could fusing pohatu and onua into a rock element. We could keep po-koro and turn onu-koro into a village of psonics or lightning. That is what i think you should do.

I think that po-matoran are stronger than other matoran to better survive in their harsh enviroment, similar to how Onu-matoran can see better in the dark, and how Ga-Matoran have improved lung capacity.

I’m not sure what you mean by this. Flora and plantlife are the same element.

Lightning is already an element is SirKeksalot’s plan, and I assume that it’ll have it’s own village/region. Additionally, Sirkeksalot has explained why he doesn’t want to include psionics/sonics as a toa element in this topic:

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welp, that destroys a lot of my points, but I still have an arguement!

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That’s actually a good point. It’s easier to keep Lewa green if black is the color for Flora, which I can rationalize by making the exteriors of the “trees” black on this planet, rather than brown like we’re used to on Earth.

Most colors are decided for sure:

  • Ta-Matoran: Red
  • Ga-Matoran: Blue
  • Po-Matoran: Orange (brown is just dark orange and Pohatu isn’t bright orange or anything, he’s more Huki’s color like in G2)
  • Onu-Matoran: Black plus purple or green (contingent on the decision in this thread)
  • Ko-Matoran: White plus cool colors
  • Le-Matoran: Green probably (G2 made Lewa a Toa of Jungle because focus groups got confused by his greenness, so I’ve contemplated associating Air with cyan instead, but I may not have to do that)
  • Av-Matoran: Yellow plus white
  • Vo-Matoran: Purple
  • Flora OR Kinesis Matoran: Which one this ends up being rests on the subject of this thread
  • Fe-Matoran: Gunmetal plus orange OR copper plus green/cyan; essentially, the color of a metal and its oxide
  • Poison Matoran: Lime or cyan? Not decided tbh
  • Ash: Grey plus warm colors

I want to clarify: they’re being merged no matter what. Which Toa keeps the element is what I can’t decide.

Could you elaborate? Flora and Plantlife are the same element, first of all; second, how does Air figure into this?

Why would it be the village of Lightning? I mean, a telluric planet’s core is a giant magnet, so getting close to the core is technically something you could argue for the Vo-Matoran doing, but here’s the thing: the Matoran don’t know everything about physics or nature, so I’d have to contrive some way for them to know something no tribal society would. I already have to deal with them knowing what magnetism is; this only exacerbates that.

Ok, first, I didn’t know that you had just renamed plantlife to flora, and second, I was talking about the matoran and the villages, not as much the toa.

But, again, what is the problem? Like, specifically, what is the issue here? And I’m not being snarky, I’m genuinely lost.

The thing is, the le-matoran live in the jungle, and are green and the matoran of plantlife live in the jungle, and are green. It would make le-matoran and bo-matoran indistinguishable, just like some po-matoran and onu-matoran.
but the thing is, this is your story, so you could do whatever you wanted with it.

So, what I explained in the OP is that, should Onu-Matoran replace the Bo-Matoran as the Matoran of Flora, Onu-Wahi will be under a forest, not in it. It’s still in a cave, but the roots of the forest tunnel deep enough for them to bore into the caverns the Onu-Matoran live in, providing the basis for their agriculture.

To be clear, Le-Wahi is a forest canopy. Even if Bo- and Onu-Matoran stay separate, the Bo-Matoran will just live under the Le-Matoran in a swamp. Their border will be like halfway up the trees.

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y’know what? I have a idea. make one of the regions a place like the city of the mask makers, where all different types of matoran live together. you could also make an av-matoran region.

For the sake of exploring very specific ideas in the story, there are initially the original six main villages, with smaller settlements on the outskirts. Matoran of one sort generally keep to their homeland–again, this is something I intend to use as a narrative device, and it’s hard to explain without just showing my hand now–so a “city of the mask makers” area doesn’t quite make sense; at least not at the start of the story.

The Av-Matoran, as I’m currently fleshing them out, are rare and spread out and don’t really have a region to call home right now. Their history and current situation draws on historically-marginalized human ethnic groups, and many Matoran actually look down on them. Even Takua, the incumbent Chronicler, has to put up with this.

ok, just do what you want. It’s your story after all.

I think an important thing to consider in this discussion is that pohatu’s name literally translates to stone.

I mean, that doesn’t really matter to me. In this context, these are Matoran names, not Maori names. Plus, “Whenua” means “earth,” as might “Onua” (it’s not really obvious where the name comes from, but it supposedly comes from some Nigerian language and means “earth and strength”), so there’s no winning in that department.

@ToaOfPlastic Onepu’s name translates to sand, but that doesn’t make a him a matoran of sand. Likewise, I think that Pohatu’s name still fits, since the word “stone” is related to Earth/rock.

@SirKeksalot Would av-matoran be able to change their colors, like in g1 bionicle? If not, will Takua be white and yellow?

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They cannot, as Matoran only have specific adaptations relevant to their native element and not powers they can use at will. Not all Matoran are the exact same colors–some Ta-Matoran have orange as their secondary color, some have black, some have both and some have neither, and they may even have blue–but they do share the same main color. MNOG and MNOG2 NPCs illustrate color variety fairly well, though they don’t show the full limits of variation either.

Takua is predominantly yellow, but has a blue mask and red hands. Av-Matoran do, however, glow a little, which is easiest to see in a dark environment.

I’m not convinced that Onu-Koro traslate well to Flora, particullary because I find mining a too important profesion to lose in the island, more than Po-Koro carving.

If you include Flora, the logical color is green and live in a forest (aka Le-Koro). So you could move (and recolor) air to be the brown one. They could live in the desert (where are strong winds) and maybe live in a place with high rock columns (like Karda Nui), so they move in the hights.

If you don’t want to also change air, I think a better option is have Lightning as a village. Also, I don’t understand what you mean with Kinesis as an element.

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I may have done a poor job specifying this, but Onu-Koro still has a mostly mining-based economy. The Matoran bore into the earth to find what they need to live, just as plants do.

Air’s not going anywhair because that means I need to overhaul two Toa and villages, and both Lewa and Onua need a new paint job. I want to minimize the change here. The Onu-Matoran can still have green, but they must remain black because Onua himself is black. The Le-Matoran, ideally, will stay green, as will Lewa. Changing the biome of the Le-Matoran means I need to change their entire way of life, too, so that’s all just a no-go.

Lightning doesn’t really correlate to Onua or Pohatu’s fighting styles, and I’m not missing a chance to canonize Voriki.

Mechanical energy. The Toa of Kinesis–Pohatu or whoever else it’d be–can manipulate the flow of kinetic and potential energy. Throw a rock at him, and he can suck out the kinetic energy of its movement to make it stop, then redirect that energy into a melee attack. That’s the kinda thing you can expect from this element in combat.