You’ve got a faxon? I’m jealous
Mmmmaybe…? Depends on whether you’re going to copy that for your own Gaaki, or is it for something completely different? Either way, not today, man’s gotta sleep.
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Oh no, I’m not entering the Hagah contests. Just looking for fresh techniques.
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The lens has a story reason for existing, and the microphone… doesn’t really look like a mic to me. Meanwhile, the HF helmets look more like commando helmets than Toa masks, especially Stringer’s with the speaker pattern.
Sure, that’s kinda subjective, but hey, it’s only my reason for voting. If you want to vote for a Stringer helmet, I will haunt you in your dreams can’t tell you you shouldn’t
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Yo, despite all the arguments, and snarky comments, and opposing viewpoints, and frustrations we’ve had over the past few … uhh … days? months? Years? It feels like years. Anyway, despite all that, I’m really looking forward to this contest. Honestly, these are probably going to be the highlight of April for me. These contests are one of few times I’ve seriously engaged with the community, and I’m glad I have. It feels exciting be part of a community leaving a mark on the Bionicle story, small as it is. A big thanks to all the people behind the scenes for making this happen.
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Time for another batch of feedback! Just so you guys are on the same page about it, we’ve sent Greg some questions regarding several hot-button issues in this topic. Most notably, the ever-expanding controversy regarding the Hagah masks, their shaping, Pouks, etc. etc. We’re currently awaiting his reply on that as well as a few other questions, and when he replies we’ll let you guys know.
Yeah, that’s fine. We don’t care HOW they hold it, just that they do in their hands. Upside-down shields are also fine.
Vision mask is fine! So is the Mask of Elemental Energy.
That’s a really cool idea, but what we mean by “in the hand” is that they need to hold it how Norik and Iruini do. So… yeah. They need to hold it in the same stature as Norik and Iruini do.
@Toa-of-Snow is right that we don’t want to mandate people to draw characters that contests aren’t being held for. However, you do raise a good point about like it being beneficial. If we made the entry period long enough to make it a non-issue, I guess it could conceivably work. I’d like some more feedback on this point: what would you all think about mandating Norik and Iruini for the group art portion? This is something we can garner feedback on more as the contest goes on.
Unfortunately, the only way to restrict that possibility would be to vote on them as a grouping instead of a character-by-character basis, which we’re not going to do. If your scenario ends up happening, I agree personally that it would look weird, but it ultimately wouldn’t break any established canon, so it would be how it goes. People need to brace themselves for the potential that the metallic color ratios might not be perfectly even between the characters. I get it, I’m a fan of symmetry and even distribution myself, but things might not shake out that way.
Bingo. Props for pointing out a discrepancy @TheJerminator, but ultimately the quantity of times it’s been mentioned as a helmet coupled with the fact that they’re more recent means that’s how we’re going to treat it. It’s allowed. 
Unfortunately not, that’s way too specific of an edge case and it wouldn’t really fit into either category. I sympathize with the problem, though; if you run into trouble with time constraints, I’d heavily advise making a Studio build because that could help you out a lot. 
We want them to be held, displayed, and posed in the same stature as Norik and Iruini. That’s the whole point behind the stipulation. I get that it doesn’t make sense to some of you, but there’s a precedent set for how the Toa in G1 wield shields and we want to follow it.
Keep in mind: there’s nothing stopping you from including alternative storage methods, action shots, slamming the shield down, etc. or whatever you want as alternative photos in your MoC topic. We love seeing cool stuff, and it could help sell your creation and show it off. Your entry photo, though, has to have the shield be held in the hand or stored on the back.
We want to preserve the uniformity between the team. Norik and Iruini hold their shields in a certain way, ALL BIONICLE G1 characters with the exception of like… Onua Mistika hold their shields in their hand. This is commonplace. Ergo, we want to have that team cohesion with the other two Hagah who hold their shields normally. That being said, feel free to take alternative photos with the shield stored elsewhere or in cool action poses! You’re more than welcome to. **It just can’t be your entry photo; your entry photo has to have it be held in the hand or mounted on theri back.
We heavily considered it, but in the end, it’s not going to be allowed. There’s too much potential variation and ways that design parameters can be bent or subverted if we allow its inclusion. We’ve seen a lot of cool builds with it, of course, like the one that was circulated earlier in this topic, but ultimately allowing it would go against the spirit of what we’re trying to do.
Nope, we’re not gonna mandate any pose restrictions at this time.
Correct, we’re allowing its inclusion. There’s too much reasonable doubt for Hydraxon potentially being a public figure or otherwise known for his actions in the past with the Hand of Artakha, Order, or whatever, at which time someone could have potentially fashioned a Kanohi based on him. Unlikely? A little. Possible? Definitely. We’re not in the business of arbitrarily restricting unless there’s a direct contradiction, and that’s Greg’s philosophy as well; the “implied Kanohi” quote is a good point, but I think restricting this piece’s inclusion is a lot more trouble than it’s worth. Ultimately, I think this is one issue that could definitely be left up to the voters.
Sorry for missing it! Yes, that is totally allowed, and a really cool idea to boot! I was at first totally skeptical that it would have any functional benefit, but after reading your post, it makes perfect sense. Go for it!
That’s… actually a really, really good point. I see what you were getting at now, and honestly, I forgot about that key distinction. I do recall us calling them “exceptions” before, and in that context, it makes sense. What an interesting dilemma…
I’d really love some more feedback on this from the topic at large. What do you guys think about this issue? Does creative expression and freedom to create custom mask designs in the group art portion matter enough to warrant keeping this freedom, or would recognizing the mask design in the free-for-all as canon be more important in the long run? Thanks @ToaKebaka for articulating this. I see the merits of both and I’m not ready to say 100%, but I’d love to get some more dialogue circulating to gauge some other opinions. We think this topic deserves special focus, so we’re actually going to be making a new topic about it to gauge some opinions with a survey curated specifically for this issue. SO HOORAY FOR TOPIC #3, COMING SOON
First of all, these MoCs are exceptional and totally validate the decision to mandate Metru builds. You’re able to do a lot of creative stuff here and I respect it. As Eljay stated, the shields being held in their hand rather than mounted on the wrist and the feet needing to be metallic would be the only changes needed to make these acceptable. You can still have these kinds of dynamic action poses with wrist-mounted shields (if you want) as alternate images in your MoC topic; it’s just the entry photo that would need the shield to be held in the hand or stored on the back.
Unfortunately not. It’s the same way as wearing a watch on your wrist and having free movement in your fingers doesn’t count as the watch being in your hand. The fact that we can see their fingers automatically makes it a no-go. The type of connection we’re looking for is in keeping with Norik and Iruini and how they hold their shields; at least, for the entry photo.
GUYS I’M LITERALLY CRYING WITH LAUGHTER RIGHT NOW THESE POSTS HAVE ME SOBBING ON MY KEYBOARD WHAT A MOOD
Thanks for sharing your MoCs! Here’s what will need to be changed on a character-by-character basis, and it almost entirely focuses on color blocking.
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Bomonga: The upper-chest armor, shoulder armor (where the Skrall armor is), shield, upper-leg armor, and feet would need to be gold. The gold shin-guards would need to be replaced with a non-metallic color.
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Gaaki: 100% fine as is, great work (and creative torso armor design!)
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Pouks: Silver lower-leg armor would need to be replaced with a non-metallic shade, and the upper-leg armor would need to be silver.
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Kualus: The shield would need to be gold.
Additionally, right now usage of Glatorian helmets are banned, however we are considering allowing them under the caveat that the final art portion would re-draw them as another mask. That’s open for debate right now, and we will be making another topic about the issue for further discussion.
Thank you so much for the positivity, I just spent literal hours catching up and replying to all these posts and ending it on a positive sentiment was appreciated. It’s post 429… but better that than nothing. 
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It seems far more appropriate to keep the masks from the first round, given that custom masks are not necessary for a canon-compliant design. Otherwise, why couldn’t there also be placeholder colours, or placeholder armour?
There’s also the option to implement a rule for the creator to say whether or not they’d be okay with the mask being changed, but that’s kind of a slippery slope; what’s stopping the creator from saying they’re okay with the colour being changed, or the overall proportions?
(The reason this hasn’t been a slippery slope for the last two contests is because the masks had to be custom to be canon-compliant, while nothing else did. That’s not the case for these contests.)
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I’d actually be pretty disappointed if a cool art piece didn’t get through just because Norik and Iruini weren’t in it. These are Canon Contests, and therefore, it shouldn’t be important to depict things that are already canon. At least in my opinion.
(Doesn’t mean it hurts to have them there, though. )
Ok, so like, this doesn’t bother me either way, but I would prefer the FFA to be the canon mask. I think the only think that could potentially warrant a mask change i if two are the same, but in the spirit of the FFA itself being “MoCs and Art can compete because the contest is about the canon character being depicted,” I think that it’s weird to add on "Oh, butnotthemask. That’s not canon until later.
Also kind of glad about the delay, gives me more time to prepare.
This phrasing assumes “MoC”. I’ve been talking about it from an art context. I assume the same rules apply?
Ah, well. Guess the pose I had in mind might work with it on his back, instead.
Awesome! Wasn’t actually expecting that, but it’s a pleasant surprise.
Ack, that could be visually rough. I’d better commence my bracing now and hope for the best.
Seconding this. 
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Would it be recognized as the Vision Mask, or would it officially be an unknown design that happens to look like a non-canon video game asset?
I do hope you’re not trying to get him to retcon established canon… That would be disingenuous to both the community and to Greg.
I’m torn.
In the past, I was a big proponent of allowing the metallic armour to be recoloured, and the masks the same. However, it has occurred to me that it is very likely that we’ll see a bunch of entries with a select few masks – lhikan’s Hau, and the rode come to mind – and it would be more irritating to be stuck with two Hagah wearing the same Mask than it would be to have mettalic armour imbalance.
So yes, I think that the masks should be allowed to change.
@TheJerminator well, there is no vision mask in canon and VNOG is non-canon, so it should be an unknown power.
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We’re not trying to do anything. Were it up to us, we’d leave it alone and accept the quote at face value, instead of trying to find 751 different ways to retcon a preexisting answer. The reason we’re reaching out is to not do a disservice to community members perspectives and opinions. This way, no stone is left unturned, and decisions moving forward are properly informed and there is no doubt about the path forward.
Whenever we ask Greg clarifying questions, they are asked from an unbiased and unopinionated lens. Our goal is clarity, even if it comes at the cost of our preference.
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You’re reading our minds. Just an idea, at this stage, but yeah; we’re going to be making a new topic pitching a few different solutions. In the event that happened, it would be solely the mask, rather than any other parameters, that would be able to be mandated by the creator.
To devil’s advocate for a second, what’s to stop us from simply extending the entry period to allow enough time for all characters?
Correct-o!
The latter.
Trust me… TRUST ME… we’re not. We have… very, very strong opinions on this, and will likely dedicate a whole Nak&Jay on this topic very soon (in the next week, most likely). I think that going down a selective retcon rabbit hole would be destructive for everybody involved. That being said, yeah, like Eljay said, we’re just trying to be fair. We were asked to relay a message, and we’ve done so, from a completely objective standpoint. There’s enough grey in this situation to spark all this debate, so I don’t think asking Greg hurts anything.
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I suppose I should clarify what I mean. I’ve no issue with asking for clarification. ; my worry is that you’d just get him to go back on things.
It’s the difference between “hey, when you said X, did you also mean Y”, vs. “hey, I know you said X but could you change your mind and say Y.”
But if you’ve given all relevant past answers and are just asking to make sure there’s no misunderstanding, there shouldn’t be an issue, I hope.
Sorry if I seemed a little harsh in my reply earlier.
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I think it’d be fine, seeing as how it’s supposed to be the group shot that goes up on the Hagah’s BS01 page. Obviously then the entry period should be elongated, but that basically goes without saying. But while that’s my preferred option, I’m also still fine with keeping it how it is, with the 4 being mandated, and Norik and Iruini being highly encouraged.
Yeesh, every time I try to think of a response to this, by the time I finish I’ve completely changed my viewpoint on it. Definitely something I’ll have to sleep on. All I can say is… yeah, that is very, definitely a good point 
Hype for Thunderdome Round 3 is real. “A dozen commenters enter, 2 hosts and a handful of mods leave crying! Buy your tickets today!”
Aye. Better to have 429 comments of arguments than 0 comments at all.
In all honesty, in a certain regard, these contests couldn’t be happening at a better time, all things considered. With the Panny-D going on for the foreseeable future, the contests are a great way for people to get their mind away from that heartache and stress, and focus on something productive (and stressful in a different way ). And as you and Eljay have made clear time and again, these contests haven’t exactly been easy on you guys either, and I appreciate you two, Kini, Infrared, Invi, and all the others putting in the time and effort to make sure they go as well as possible. 10 years from G1’s cancellation, and the theme is still going strong, thanks in no small part to you guys and the boards. Stay strong 
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I’d say for group art, eh adding Iruini and Norik maybe not be a requirement, but I’d be likely to vote for a depiction that includes em.
I wouldnt mandate it, but just stating that for the artists to keep in mind.
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So my current concerns are:
- When it is said that only one metallic color is allowed, is that meant as general color (i.e. Silver/Gold/Copper/Gunmetal) or ultra-specific Lego color? Since the latter gets murky. Don’t want to see someone get disqualified because one silver piece is ever so slightly darker or lighter.
- When it comes to height, does that include the mask? Because an Iruini-build with a Rode would be taller…
Would like to know how strict/loose these rules are.
I don’t think Norik/Iruini should be mandated, no.
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Then consider that worry no longer. We’re not doing that. Others in this community have tried and are trying. We. Are. Not.
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100% yes. Again, the point is to have coherent unified look between all six Toa because they are a team. And I value this more than anything in regards to this canon contest.
Isn’t the rule that the earliest answer counts?
But Toa Hagah are a team. If the final task was to draw four characters in the style of 2005 comics, it wouldn’t be necessary.
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Not necessairily, Greg has stated he reserves the right to change his mind on things. Like I said prior, I think the only proper resolution would be to have Greg re-adress it. I think it mainly applies to the LMB-onwards era.
Hot take: Norik should be mandated but not Iruini. After all, Iruini wasn’t always part of the team.
Serious answer: I feel Norik and Iruini should be encouraged but not required, but it could go either way with little impact. I imagine that even if they aren’t required… 90% of entries will draw them, and people will be much more inclined to vote for entries that include them. So in the end, it will almost certainly make little difference (I’ll be surprised if any entry in the top six doesn’t include them)
Plus, I really want to see if someone draws Norik and not Iruini. 
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